this post was submitted on 03 Feb 2025
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"Behold, a Linux maintainer openly admitting to attempting to sabotage the entire Rust for Linux project". Thoughts on this post from Marcan? (social.treehouse.systems)
submitted 1 day ago by TheTwelveYearOld@lemmy.world to c/linux@lemmy.ml
15 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

Behold, a Linux maintainer openly admitting to attempting to sabotage the entire Rust for Linux project:

https://lwn.net/ml/all/20250131075751.GA16720@lst.de/

The good news is this doesn't affect drm/asahi, our GPU driver. The bad news is it does affect all the other drivers we're (re)writing in Rust, two so far with a third one coming.

Another choice quote, calling R4L "cancer": https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/20250128092334.GA28548@lst.de/

Personally, I would consider this grounds for removal of Christoph from the Linux project on Code of Conduct violation grounds, but sadly I doubt much will happen other than draining a lot of people's energy and will to continue the project until Linus says "fuck you" or something.

As for how to move forward, if I were one of the Rust maintainers, I would just merge the patch (which does not touch code formally maintained by the dissenter). Either Linus takes the pull, and whatever Christoph says is irrelevant, or he doesn't, and R4L dies. Everything else is a waste of everyone's time and energy.

Edit: Sent in my 2 cents: https://lore.kernel.org/rust-for-linux/2b9b75d1-eb8e-494a-b05f-59f75c92e6ae@marcan.st/T/#m1944b6d485070970e359bbc7baa71b04c86a30af

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[–] bastion@feddit.nl 3 points 17 hours ago* (last edited 17 hours ago)

it's often the people saying "don't listen to all the drama" that are making drama.

chill out. the guy has relevant concerns, and they matter deeply to him. ..and they matter deeply to us, the users of Linux. Rust in the kernel is a good step forward, but processes need to be in place not just for code, but for people who will be dealing with a new language in their formerly-c-only environment.

win hearts and minds, don't just kick the nest and blame the hornets if they sting you. recognize needs, even of those who are stubborn, and address them.

[–] Dirk@lemmy.ml 4 points 20 hours ago

I can't wait for Brodie to report on this!

[–] Viri4thus@feddit.org 40 points 1 day ago

Ok, this is made to sound worse than it is. You guys really huff too much drama.

[–] MNByChoice@midwest.social 29 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Phrasing.

A Linux maintainer wants to keep quality high. Objects to adding complexity to codebase.

Right or wrong, we want the maintainers focused on quality and maintainability.

[–] catloaf@lemm.ee 4 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Is rust more maintainable than C?

[–] hedgehog@ttrpg.network 10 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

If you’re a C developer who doesn’t know Rust, no.

[–] catloaf@lemm.ee 6 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Well this code would be maintained by developers who know rust, so it sounds like a good merge to me!

[–] atzanteol@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 day ago

Does the rust code not depend on any C code?

It's not so simple to say "it's separate" if there are still dependencies and if the rust code can be broken by C changes.

I'm not defending either position.

[–] semperverus@lemmy.world 16 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Looks like Paolo served you a slice of humble pie there at the end.

Please keep this kind of FUD elsewhere, thank you.

[–] moomoomoo309@programming.dev 2 points 19 hours ago* (last edited 19 hours ago) (1 children)

Yeah...until Christoph replied and confirmed what Hector was saying was true and not FUD. He didn't mince words, he said he did not want Rust in Linux whatsoever, only for new codebases, not existing ones like Linux.

[–] semperverus@lemmy.world 1 points 18 hours ago* (last edited 18 hours ago) (1 children)

Christoph is an engineer and has been for a long time. There are probably considerations he is making that you either cannot or are refusing to fathom. He's clearly not against rust in general, just in mixing languages in one codebase.

To be clear though, I personally don't have a horse in this race, I am speaking somewhat as an outside observer, so i gain nothing from you getting your way or Christoph his.

Stop and think without attributing malice to why someone in his position would make the statements and decisions he's making. He's not an idiot.

[–] apt_install_coffee@lemmy.ml 3 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

We should be looking at his given reasons, not making assumptions based on some ineffable set of considerations that he might have.

Christof's given reason of complexity is sensible, it's also one already considered when allowing R4L in the first place; adding rust language support has been deemed worth the additional complexity.

[–] semperverus@lemmy.world 1 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

Deemed by who though?

[–] apt_install_coffee@lemmy.ml 2 points 8 hours ago

Either Linus or Greg K-H, likely after feedback from many others.

[–] tekato@lemmy.world 7 points 1 day ago

I sincerely hope your reply in the mailing list was satire .