this post was submitted on 22 Aug 2024
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[–] MyOpinion@lemm.ee 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

After endless scams, have people figured out yet that Crypto is a scam?

[–] Nougat@fedia.io 0 points 3 months ago (2 children)

The technology isn't, but it can be easily abused by malicious actors, using the exact same methods as shown in Wolf of Wall Street.

[–] stonerboner@lemmynsfw.com 0 points 3 months ago (6 children)

Until there is an actual use case for Crypto, it’s definitely a scam as a technology. It exists only for investors and scammers, anyone attempting to actually use it is getting reamed.

[–] Chocrates@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I liked the public ledger of contracts idea someone had. You use the public block chain to sign and store stuff like mortgages, that way everyone sees the same copy.

[–] tal@lemmy.today 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

The problem is that there are much-simpler ways to achieve that, if that's all you want. You just take a digital copy of the contract, timestamp it, and have each party cryptographically sign the contract. You don't need a distributed ledger for that.

[–] sazey@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Distribution ensure integrity of data. Let's say we sign a contract, cryptographically sign it and all that good stuff but then oh no, where we stored your contract went up in fire and now I don't have to honour that contract. (contrived example I know)

[–] tal@lemmy.today 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

All parties who are involved in the contract can store a copy of a contract, even if it's not distributed to everyone else.

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[–] Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago

My friend really hyped up crypto as the thing that would replace all local currencies in every country. That we would just have crypto, and thats it.

Thats when I knew it was a scam. My friend is an idiot, and falls for 100% of scams. When he's preaching something, I know it's wrong.

[–] Nougat@fedia.io 0 points 3 months ago (3 children)

The ancient Greeks invented steam power, but didn't take it any further than a novelty. That doesn't make steam power a "scam."

[–] magic_lobster_party@fedia.io 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

That doesn’t mean cryptocurrencies is like steam power.

[–] Nougat@fedia.io 0 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Each is a technology with unique features for its time, and where there aren't any practical applications initially.

[–] Honytawk@lemmy.zip 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Still doesn't mean crypto is like steam, nor that it will ever have any practical application

[–] Nougat@fedia.io 0 points 3 months ago

I'm sure the ancient Greeks said similar things about their steam pinwheels.

[–] magic_lobster_party@fedia.io 0 points 3 months ago

For each steam power there are thousands of similar inventions that never see the light of practical use cases. We just remember those that had significant breakthroughs.

[–] Stovetop@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago

I dunno, most steam power just involves passing an environmental burden down several generations, which seems like a scam to me.

[–] stonerboner@lemmynsfw.com 0 points 3 months ago

You might have had a salient point if the ancient Greeks made it popular for “solving thirst across the known world,” but really it was a novelty. Or if crypto was marketed as a novelty. But crypto was hyped to be the next big things, spreading around the world, no monetary boundaries. The same people making those claims are spending hundreds of millions on the election to making sure it stay unregulated with no consumer protection.

But sure, crypto somehow parallels steam?

[–] EngineerGaming@feddit.nl 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I thought the same, but changed my mind after my bank card stopped working for foreign services. Now Monero is the most straightforward way to pay for my VPS and domain, since getting a foreign card would be prohibitively expensive, and the local companies with foreign servers - the ones I can pay with my card for - are likely to submit to the same censorship I want to bypass.

Even for those who can use their cards, crypto can be useful - for those who would be endangered by using a KYC payment method (activists and dissidents, for example). Even currencies without privacy protections are still leagues easier to use privately than a KYC method.

[–] stonerboner@lemmynsfw.com 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

99.9% of people could not pay for what they want or need except the handful of niche places that happen to accept it. Can’t pay medical bills with it, can’t buy my food at the grocery store with it, can’t buy my gas with it, can’t really apply it where I want to, only in the few spaces I get to.

That’s not what the developers claimed it would do, or what the investors wanted it to do. It’s not cost effective or simple. It’s created more problems than it’s solved. It flat out a scam.

[–] EngineerGaming@feddit.nl 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

For the cases you described, there is the most convenient and anonymous type of money - cash)

But yea, reception is a problem. However, there is still an assortment of services accepting Monero, including the VPS that is vital for me now. It can also be used to buy prepaid cards, for cases when they are actuay accepted.

[–] stonerboner@lemmynsfw.com 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (2 children)

How is it convenient? Its not simple setting up a wallet, picking a coin, registering with a market, hoping that the merchant you want something for happens to take your type of coin? And being anonymous is a turn off for most people- the vast majority of people want consumer protection. Merchants carry higher risk with a volatile, unregulated market, so they are hesitant to accept it.

Why would I pay fees to buy a faux currency, to pay for a pre-paid card of the same currency I used to buy to the faux currency, to spend it on things that can’t be paid for with the faux currency anyway? What?!?!

[–] EngineerGaming@feddit.nl 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

By "convenient" I meant in comparison with getting a foreign card for me, which involves bureaucracy and (by my measure) incredibly expensive travel. As for "picking a coin" - that is not really an issue, since swaps between currencies can be done instantly and very easily. And there are only a few major coins that are commonly accepted anyway (BTC, LTC, XMR and maybe ETH).

For people needing anonymity, giving up consumer protection may be an acceptable tradeoff. Same as with cash.

Pre-paid cards make sense because said cards may be unavailable where the customer resides, and either they can't (like me) or don't want to use a KYC method to buy them.

As for difficulty for the merchant - yeah, I agree it is a significant downside.

P.S. Fees are indeed a problem in Bitcoin at least, but Monero's are barely noticeable.

[–] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (5 children)

There are only really two cryptocurrencies you should care about:

  • Bitcoin - figure out how the Lighting network works
  • Monero

That's it. Which wallet you use is up to you, and there are plenty of easy ones freely available for phones (e.g. I use Monerujo on Android).

Bitcoin is the most widely used coin, and Monero is the most privacy-friendly. You can exchange between them using something like Kraken (perhaps the best place to buy/exchange crypto). Bitcoin transactions are slow (processed every 4 hours, I think?), expensive (like multiple dollars), and publicly traceable (if you have the wallet id, you can see everyone you've transacted with and how much), which is where Lightning comes in, which dramatically reduces transaction time, reduces fees, and improves privacy. Monero is private by default, and the way it handles transactions discourages mining farms, so there's usually a bit less speculation and generally way lower fees (usually <$0.01).

As for why you'd do it, it's because you value your privacy or you do a lot of international transactions (cryptocurrencies don't care what country the two parties are in). If you buy a pre-paid card w/ credit or debit, the banks can track that transaction and potentially figure out what you used the pre-paid card for, and if they work w/ the government, it's trivial to track that down (e.g. if you live in or visit a place like China). With Monero, they can only track interactions w/ fiat (i.e. buying or selling at an exchange), they can't tell where you used those funds or anything of that sort. And that's true even if they collude with the buyer or seller, they can't track Monero wallet details to an individual on either end of the transaction.

Some stores offer a discount for buying w/ Monero (and potentially other coins), such as the YouTuber "Mental Outlaw," who hosts based.win and offers a 10% discount for buying in Monero.

That said, there aren't a ton of place that accept cryptocurrency, which is a bummer. But the more people start to use it for even small things, the more likely stores are to accept it. That's my dog in this race, I want to use Monero where it's available so the few stores that accept it continue to, and hopefully they'll find enough value in it to get other stores on board. I don't hate fiat or anything, I just hate how much tracking there is with other digital payment systems.

[–] stonerboner@lemmynsfw.com 0 points 3 months ago (3 children)

What is needed before crypto can actually be useful:

  • needs to be as easy to use as real currency
  • needs to be able to be spent freely on basic necessities
  • recourse for fraud
  • recourse to recover lost keys instead of losing funds permanently
  • protection against market manipulation
  • widespread merchant adoption
  • address liquidity concerns
  • actionable process to protect from illegal activities
  • MASSIVE environmental protections- crypto was worse for the environment 4 years ago than AI is projected to be in 2027

There’s more, but I won’t bother as the above issues are more than enough to confirm that crypto is a scam.

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[–] TheBat@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago

Bold claim. Zero supporting arguments. Nice.

[–] cheese_greater@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

They should play Beyonce's Freedom to cap the sentencing

[–] Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I hear she doesn't consent to convicted criminals using her songs...

[–] cheese_greater@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago

Even criminals deserve good outro themes

[–] db2@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Oh no the poor bank, better have a bailout quick.

[–] atrielienz@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Given that he was embezzling bank funds to funnel into a fake crypt scam, and the people who those funds belonged to were not in fact the bank, and the article suggests those people were not made whole, I'm just gonna say that it's not about the bank, it's about the people who lost shit like their life savings to this a-hole.

[–] idunnololz@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (6 children)

Because the bank was insured by the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC), the FDIC "absorbed the $47.1 million loss" after "Hanes’ fraudulent actions caused HTSB to fail and the bank investors to lose $9 million," the US Attorney's Office said.

It sounds like no customer with the bank lost anything. Only investors who I assume are well off anyways.

[–] atrielienz@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

The banks customers were not the only people who he stole from. However, I concede the point.

[–] idunnololz@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Oh yeah. That's fair.

I guess the silver lining here was that it could have been so much worse but thank goodness for FDIC.

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[–] Darkassassin07@lemmy.ca 0 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Hanes stole tens of thousands from a local church, then a local investor club, and finally his daughter's college fund, NBC News reported. Then when all those wells dried up, he started stealing bank funds

Wow, what a PoS

[–] Shawdow194@fedia.io 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

"Many victims will never fully recoup losses to their life savings and retirement funds, but at least we at the Department of Justice can see that Hanes is held criminally responsible for his actions."

[–] teft@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago

I would hope most people would be made whole through FDIC insurance. That's 250k per depositor, per insured bank, for each account ownership category.

[–] ShepherdPie@midwest.social 0 points 3 months ago

It states that he never once received anything back yet was convinced even after being arrested and sending 10s of millions of dollars into a black hole, that he only needed another month or two to earn everything back. How the fuck can someone be duped so hard?

[–] PeachMan@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Kinda misleading or poorly written title. He was not convicted of falling for a crypto scam. He was convicted of embezzling funds from the bank, which he did while pumping them into a dumb crypto scam. It would have been illegal even if the crypto thing was NOT a scam (which is rare, I know).

[–] Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

And to think, I almost felt pity for him.

[–] kameecoding@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Almost doing some heavy lifting there

[–] xavier666@lemm.ee 0 points 3 months ago (3 children)

even if the crypto thing was NOT a scam (which is rare, I know).

that comment had to hurt the crypto community hard

[–] qaz@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago

The people who still don't know have built up a level of ignorance to miss any kind of message like that.

[–] msage@programming.dev 0 points 3 months ago

If they could read

[–] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

TBH I feel like it's much harder for anti-crypto ideologues to admit that crypto has non-scam usages. Or to admit that fiat currency is a scam so huge that it's literally destroying the planet.

[–] orrk@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

to be fair, buying drugs or untraceable money transfers are totally a use case of crypto (basically everything that is illegal)

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[–] slaacaa@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (2 children)

Wild story, but many things I don’t get:

  • How could a bank CEO be so stupid to fall a financial scam like this? He must know how these work, banks are constantly fighting against scams and warning customers
  • How the fuck the bank would allow the CEO to go rouge and request/make these transactions? They have board, supervisory board, risk mgmt, yet nobody stopped or noticed the fraud until his neighbor(!) told them. This institution shouldn’t be allowed to handle people’s money
  • Wtf is the attorney’s sad speech about being unsure ppl getting back their savings? They were insured, they get the money back. Pay the fuck up and reimburse your clients for the bank’s mistake
[–] ByteOnBikes@slrpnk.net 0 points 3 months ago (2 children)

This one blew me away.

According to NBC News, Hanes missed at least one opportunity to realize that he was being scammed. After he asked for a $12 million loan from a neighbor, Brian Mitchell, his neighbor detected the scam and refused to lend the money.

My limit is like $40.

[–] Plopp@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Cheap bastard! Who would deny their neighbor coming over to borrow some sugar and a couple mills?

[–] echodot@feddit.uk 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Well the house is presumably up for purchase now. I feel like I want to be this guy's neighbor.

Hey Bob, I want to buy a luxury yacht but I only have $12.50 in the bank, can I borrow $2 million please I'll have it back to you by Friday.

[–] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 0 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Uh, a luxury yacht costs a lot more than $2M, $2M gets you a premium fishing/speed boat.

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[–] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 3 months ago

How could a bank CEO be so stupid

Seriously?

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