Less than 5 probably
this post was submitted on 21 Jul 2024
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Negative 20 is in fact less than five and twenty, so I think you are both technically correct.
The crooked third caption may cause mental distress
All ~~capitalist~~ countries...
Fixed it for you
All nation states
I'm 13 and this is deep.
Yep, just slapping a "communist party" sticker on the property owning class doesn't make a difference
Tbf it's not that anybody saw that coming. Maybe Bakunin, Kropotkin, Malatesta and all the other anarchists but aside from them, nobody could have known it.
What are you talking about?
I'm talking about bolshevik parties and their bureaucracy becoming the new capitalist or ruling class as Bakunin told Marx would happen
Why do democratically elected government officials constitute a "class?" How would Socialism be Capitalism?
The soviets were democratic but the bolsheviks smashed the soviets as soon as they realized they wouldn't infiltrate them and stayed a Soviet Union in name only. Why wouldn't they keep the soviets as a decision making body if the were interested in a democratic government?
No, the Bolsheviks did not smash the soviets. The Factory Committees were replaced with the Union system, because the Factory Committees were acting in their own interests irrespective of the needs of the whole. The Union system added the interconnected element to the Soviet Planning system. The Soviet system retained until the collapse of the USSR.
The wikipedia article on Soviet Democracy makes this clear, the Soviets were the main operating organ of the USSR throughout its lifetime. If you believe the Soviets to be democratic, then you believe the USSR to be democratic, or misunderstood the history of the Soviets within the USSR. This is on top of you referencing a wild anti-semite who considered the state itself to be a Jewish conspiracy as reasoning for complete anarchism alone.
I think you need to hit the books for a bit and come back later. Blackshirts and Reds goes over what did work, and what did not work in the USSR. There were definitely issues with it, but it was democratic.
The above commenter is wrong about it being capitalist, but they're right about there being a ruling class in the USSR. The ruling class was the communist party, the "intelligentsia." Communist party members pre-selected candidates for all political appointments, and becoming a member of the communist party involved passing through multiple stages of party-administered education and then having your past scrutinized and approved by committees of existing communist party members.
At its' highest level of membership it never surpassed roughly 3% of the population. That is a politically privileged class that enjoyed better wages, benefits, general living conditions, and political influence than the general population.
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Why do you want to break Lemmy
Sure, but that hasn't happened, historically.
The funny thing is that you'll have a hard time defending that the North Europe ones are governed by the property owning class... So this one is actually false. But it does apply to all countries that call themselves communist.
Anyway, it's a very rare oddity for a country to have such a strong middle class that rich people can not reign free. Good for those few ones that managed it.
(And yeah, talk about non-sequitur on the 4rt one. It's ridiculous. Yeah, the best way to fight climate change is by supporting a revolution lead by the OP's favorite fascists. No explanation needed.)
The funny thing is that you'll have a hard time defending that the North Europe ones are governed by the property owning class... So this one is actually false. But it does apply to all countries that call themselves communist.
All of the Nordic Countries are Dictatorships of the Bourgeoisie, they have seen sliding worker protections over time and increased disparity. Occasionally, Capitalists will make concessions to keep their power for longer, that's what happened in the Nordics.
You are correct about Communist countries, they are directed by the Proletariat, who now owns the property. I doubt that's what you were meaning, though.
Anyway, it's a very rare oddity for a country to have such a strong middle class that rich people can not reign free. Good for those few ones that managed it.
It's not really rare, it happened in Nazi Germany and fascist Italy. Social Democracy is not fascism, but the idea of the Middle and Upper classes collaborating, ie the petite bourgeoisie and bourgeoisie against the proletariat, is something Social Democracy shares with fascism.
(And yeah, talk about non-sequitur on the 4rt one. It's ridiculous. Yeah, the best way to fight climate change is by supporting a revolution lead by the OP's favorite fascists. No explanation needed.)
Can you explain how OP is supporting fascism? Is Marxism "fascist" to you? Why?
Except you oversimplified and it matters. The entire point of capitalism is to centralize money in the hands of a few at the expense of the rest. Capitalism itself demands continued growth, which is unsustainable.
All forms of government are subject to corruption, but only some forms of government are broken by design.
Capitalism itself demands continued growth, which is unsustainable.
Green energy is a growth industry. No reason why capitalists can't make money building and renting new green infrastructure.
If anything, we could use a huge injection of new capital spending. We're just not getting it into energy projects. We're getting it into fantasies and scams, like Crypto and AI
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Why? Capitalism cannot solve Climate Change, as it depends on the highest possible profit margins and rampant consumerism. Transitioning from a profit-focused system to fulfilling uses and needs in Socialism, where the Proletariat is in charge and can collectively agree to tackle Climate Change, is the only path forward.
This seems like you just want to be edgy and doomerist with nothing to back yourself up.
Capitalism cannot solve Climate Change, as it depends on the highest possible profit margins and rampant consumerism.
It's definitely possible to do "Green Capitalism", so long as the profit margins of green capital exceed dirty capital.
But Americans have huge investments in old dirty infrastructure that they want to use until it falls apart. That's the real difficulty. How do you convince people with a $1B pipeline through the West Texas gas fields to scrape that project and build lower-profit windmills/solar farms and HVDC cable lines instead?
Our current leadership could subsidize green energy to move the market. But this would force existing businesses to build new capital rather than rent seeking on existing capital.
Compare the US to France, which has a huge legacy investment in nuclear power. They're capitalist, too, but they aren't in a rush to burn more fossil fuels.
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I don't know how to get everyone I know to really understand this. Every time I bring it up in conversation, the other person just puts their hands up and explains that they're powerless to address it, so it's not even worth talking about. I don't know how to respond to the apathy.
To be honest i offen feel the same, just helpless and too insignificant to change it in my own. But thats the point, we are not allone! I just try to show them undenieble facts, the already very present effect of climate crisis or just statistics of how the money is distributed in our country. The thing I struggle most with them is their bad feith in people. For example many welfare programs or in the extreme the concept of unconditional income by the state gets always used to argue that people are lazy and it would not work because no one would get a job anymore, which i disagree with
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Try recommending Marxist texts, or inserting them (tastefully) into conversation.
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I keep clicking this thumbnail because bright colorful fluffy animals.
I keep reading the text and not comprehending anything.
- We're fucked
- We've always been fucked
- Everyone's always been fucked
- Everyone is close to being really fucked
- rich people paying powerful people to get what they want is bad
- even without bribes/payoffs, powerful people in the USA have always only been rich people
- did I say USA? I meant the whole world
- we’re all gonna die if we don’t make sure people without money have a voice too, and convince powerful people not to keep polluting
we’re all gonna die if we don’t make sure people without money have a voice too, and convince powerful people not to keep polluting
You cannot convince Capitalists to "do the right thing." That was the common through-line of Utopian Socialist failures. I recommend reading Socialism: Utopian and Scientific.
That's not a bad thing, we all come to new things not understanding them at first, especially topics that we don't get a good grasp on until we're into adulthood and no longer have a structured education system to guide us. Subjects like politics, economics, sociology etc.
We all come to these daunting subjects with various levels of knowledge and ability, all we can do is try to dip our toes in to a subject that feels important to understand, get reading, watching videos, whatever works best for you, and go from there :-)
the meme format doesn't make any sense
All first world governments have some degree of corruption from money in politics, but don't kid yourselves: USA is much worse than most
Corruption in politics was described to me once as the grease that keeps the cogs of government turning. The importance difference is what type of grease is used. A government with low corruption uses a small amount of very clean grease, just enough, and only in the right places, to make the sticky gears turn. A government with high corruption will just drench every gear with very dirty crude oil, and if the gears seizes up they won't even notice.
In an ideal world the machine of government wouldn't need any corrupt grease or oil to keep turning but no one truely lives in that world, yet.
Aka “getting radicalised by bad faith actors on the internet”
Everybody is getting radicalized because moderation is killing us. It's a Hail Mary situation.
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Huh, some commenters raise a good question. What are the non-capitalist countries doing to fight climate change?
China is building out massive renewables and massive coal.
My list is short, please add to it.
It's a capitalist country, but I think France is on the right track.
They were never really on the wrong track, primarily because of their huge investment in nuclear power back in the 70s.
We couldn't have non capitalist state with imperialism However, if we consider countries without state, we shall consider EZLN and the Democnatic Confederation in Rojava. Both have very interesting approach of eco-socialism.
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What are the non-capitalist countries doing to fight climate change?
Lots of solar, wind, hydro, and nuclear energy investment in the public sector. Huge investments in mass transit and electric engines. Conversion of old coal powered steel production to electric. Dense urban real estate department. Disposable waste reduction. Big efforts at tree planting along the Gobi Desert.
They've been very "all options on the table" about climate change. Some work. Some don't. But the progress is undeniable.
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The third one is dumb, not everyone is USA
The third one is true regardless of country, as long as it is Capitalist.
go find your euro trash server then. i'm sick of you brats bitching about it. we're here to talk about america.
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