this post was submitted on 10 Jul 2024
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Democrats' private fears about Biden are slowly going public (www.npr.org)
submitted 4 months ago by theangriestbird@beehaw.org to c/politics@beehaw.org
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[–] coffeetest@beehaw.org 2 points 4 months ago (1 children)

So your comment about moderates not voting because.... they do not like either and fascism and Project 2025 are not compelling augments? Reminds me of a friend who told me that he was not voting because it doesn't matter to him. And them Trump tariffs hurt his business.

Ok your list

#1 You do not think he is winning #2 You do not believe he is capable of responding to Project 2025 because of his debate performance. #3 You've got an ageist argument and then connect that to his policy position on escalation management. #4 After a great speech you come away with not feeling good about superficial characteristics #5 You do not think he is winning

"We need something to spark the apathetic potential voters to act to save Democracy because the risk is too great and right now the low-info folks aren’t hearing anything new."

I am here arguing for the most viable option. Let's all do our best to help.

I do not agree with everything he has done but his actions have proven to me that he has been an excellent president and is a good person. I also believe he is the only viable candidate we have. Is he old and does he seem old, yes. Will he be able to lead a good and effective administration, he has and he will.

Do you think the Biden administration has been a good one and do you think a future Biden administration will be a good one?

[–] memfree@beehaw.org 4 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I don't think you read what I wrote.

  • I didn't say "moderates not voting" I said "low-information voters."
  • It isn't that WE don't have compelling reasons, it is that low-info folks are not LISTENING
  • My reasons:
  1. It doesn't matter if I think he's winning, the polls think that. Polls aren't particularly accurate, but you are willing to risk Democracy on the hopes that it is OK for people who like neither choice to stay home. I want them in the streets and in the voting booth.
  2. I do not 'believe' he is capable of responding because I watched as he failed to do so. It is evidence based.
  3. I don't care that Biden is old. Trump is old, too. I care that Biden is exhibiting evidence of a dramatic decline in ability both physical and mental.
  4. It was not a great speech. He stared at the teleprompter and punched up each word as hard as he could. Every President gets their speeches written for them, so I'm not criticizing that. but his delivery was strained. You are saying that and his zombie presence the next day are merely 'superficial', but his chances to give content have been empty. The debate, the Stephanopoulos interview, and every chance he's had to say something meaningful. He's not painting a picture of what would happen if Trump wins and how he'll work to make sure no one gets that power. He's only saying stuff he's said before.
  5. Again, it does not matter who wins the popular vote. The election is about who is going to sit out in a few swing states.
  • I think Biden is a wonderful man who did wonderful things for the U.S. -- maybe not enough, but Congress and the Courts blocked a lot. A neighbor complained that Biden went back on student loan debt forgiveness. I pointed out that, no, he didn't -- the courts blocked it. A week later, the same neighbor complained about it again. I spent five minutes explaining how the courts overruled the plan and who to be mad at. There was a similar but lesser issue with Dobbs.

Look: The polls and pundits tell me a future Biden administration will only exist in our dreams, so the only choice is to find someone else or let Trump win.

[–] coffeetest@beehaw.org 3 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I was thinking we were in a thread that started with:

I just spent the weekend with moderate relatives that are ready to stay home instead of voting in November because they don’t like either choice, and the debate solidified that position.

I didn’t say “moderates not voting” I said “low-information voters.”

I don't want to argue, I mean I admit I did but that's not really want I was intending. I think you have a valid point of view but I do not see it the way you do.

[–] memfree@beehaw.org 5 points 4 months ago

I see what you are saying and I appreciate that we are both stating our positions. I;m grateful we have a place where we can express ourselves.

You are correct that the thread started that way. I was just saying that I then reframed that as low-info voters who may or may not be moderate. Someone in another thread had talked about some leftists in California who were going t skip voting as a protest to the war in Israel -- which won't matter because California is not up for grabs.

FWIW, I watched Biden's press conference and was once again amazed as Biden reminded us of all the things he's done. He's been a great statesman and exactly the kind of world leader I want our President to be, and it baffles me that so much of the population want to pick a petty know-nothing bully like Trump.