this post was submitted on 09 Jan 2025
293 points (96.8% liked)

Fediverse

28973 readers
2388 users here now

A community to talk about the Fediverse and all it's related services using ActivityPub (Mastodon, Lemmy, KBin, etc).

If you wanted to get help with moderating your own community then head over to !moderators@lemmy.world!

Rules

Learn more at these websites: Join The Fediverse Wiki, Fediverse.info, Wikipedia Page, The Federation Info (Stats), FediDB (Stats), Sub Rehab (Reddit Migration), Search Lemmy

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

jointhefediverse.net seems to be a commonly linked resource for directing people to join the Fediverse.

Curiously, it does not list Lemmy under the list of Reddit alternatives. Their GitHub README explains why.

Previous relevant discussion: https://lemmy.ml/post/78808

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] Max_P@lemmy.max-p.me 158 points 1 week ago (6 children)

That feels like complaints about lemmy.ml specifically more than Lemmy as a software. There's a few instances that defederate lemmy.ml out there.

[–] Azzu@lemm.ee 64 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (9 children)

They can do whatever shit they want with their instance and believe whatever they want. The software they make provably doesn't have any more biases than any other software. As long as that's the case, I'm fine.

load more comments (9 replies)
[–] cupcakezealot@lemmy.blahaj.zone 20 points 1 week ago

it's complaints about the developer (which are valid) who also runs lemmy.ml.

[–] Serinus@lemmy.world 18 points 1 week ago (1 children)

How much effort do you think Meta, Twitter, and Reddit put into getting open social media people to fight against themselves?

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[–] catloaf@lemm.ee 102 points 1 week ago (23 children)

Lemmy was removed due to:

  • reports of how the developers handle certain types of content (post removed, view an incomplete archive)
  • the behavior of its creator
  • how the sotware itself handles users' privacy.

All valid concerns.

[–] Skiluros@sh.itjust.works 62 points 1 week ago (10 children)

Point 1 and 2 really need to be addressed.

It would be so much better if lemmy wasn't developed by genocide white-washing tankies.

[–] realcaseyrollins@thelemmy.club 52 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (32 children)

I hate it when people try to gatekeep like this. I don't need to be handheld. If there's a Fediverse alternative to something and it mostly works, it should be on the website. Anything less is not useful at best.

Edit: I say this as someone who has historically criticized the behavior of the devs as well as multiple Lemmy communities BTW.

[–] SirEDCaLot@lemmy.today 16 points 1 week ago

I agree 100% with this. The developers or the operators of lemmy.ml may be assholes, but the beauty of decentralization is I can simply not use their instance. I do not. Thus, while a warning label is necessary, I think more good is done by making people aware of the alternative to Reddit than by sweeping the whole thing under the rug.

As for user privacy, I'm not sure Lemmy is any worse than any other Fediverse app. There were a couple of bad things like being unable to delete a hosted image, but that has been fixed. Once again, warning label, not rug sweep.

load more comments (31 replies)
[–] Serinus@lemmy.world 41 points 1 week ago (3 children)

No, they're not.

how the developers handle certain types of content

Doesn't matter if you stay away from .ml.

the behavior of its creator

Kind of valid, but open source and open license negates a lot of that.

how the sotware itself handles users’ privacy.

You think anything else on the Fediverse is better? When you post something publicly, it's public. Doesn't really matter what the software does. If you don't have End to End encryption, it's not private.

load more comments (3 replies)
[–] Bezier@suppo.fi 35 points 1 week ago (20 children)

To me the first one is an instance problem (ml, hexbear?), and not a lemmy problem. It has looked like they've been trying to separate the two as much as possible.

[–] haverholm@kbin.earth 19 points 1 week ago (3 children)

But the Lemmy project and specific instances are not so easily separated. From the archived mastodon thread:

lemmy.ml (the official Lemmy instance) resolves to the same IP address as lemmygrad.ml (the instance that contains the most disturbing material).

Lemmy.ml also federates with lemmygrad, and the devs advertise lemmygrad on their "join lemmy" site.

Do the Lemmy developers themselves run the lemmygrad.ml site? (Its main logo is a tank, incidentally.)

So yeah, newcomers are presented with a join-lemmy site that promotes Lemmygrad and Lemmy ML, both of which appear to be run by the Lemmy devs.

That pretty much makes it a Lemmy problem.

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (19 replies)
[–] Fizz@lemmy.nz 22 points 1 week ago (4 children)

What is the issue with user privacy? These do not sound like valid concerns to me.

[–] andrew_s@piefed.social 19 points 1 week ago (8 children)

This is all quite old drama, and the issue itself is fixed now, but at one point someone kicked off about how if you uploaded a picture to Lemmy, there was no easy way to delete it (you could delete your post, but the image would still be there at whatever URL was created for it, and it wasn't even that easy for admins to find and remove it) - so I'm guessing that it stems from that.

load more comments (8 replies)
[–] vrighter@discuss.tchncs.de 18 points 1 week ago (2 children)

it's federated. It's the only way it can work. Everything still on that ist must suffer from the same thing. Federation means handing stuff to someone else. Once that's done, it's out of your hands forever.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[–] comfy@lemmy.ml 17 points 1 week ago

The linked post given on the second point is a bit flimsy. It's basically saying that if you use evidence published by a person with shitty views, you must have them too. To me, that's absurd as claiming that referencing FBI statistics makes someone a federal agent.

load more comments (17 replies)
[–] cm0002@lemmy.world 42 points 1 week ago (13 children)

It's almost certainly because of the tankie factory that is .ml and the fact that it's admins are all hard core tankies (including the main dev! And ofc the whole infamous Nutomic transphobe incident)

Coupled with the fact that a few of the biggest communities are on .ml does not bode well.

That's why I keep calling for a general boycott against posting content or comments on .ml communities.

.ml doesn't want growth, they want a tankie echo chamber, if anybody wants to actually see Lemmy grow at a healthy pace it starts with shuning the hostile tankies and their instances.

[–] Blaze@feddit.org 27 points 1 week ago (13 children)

Coupled with the fact that a few of the biggest communities are on .ml does not bode well.

https://lemmyverse.net/communities?order=active_month

  • 0 community in the top 10
  • 2 communities in the top 20

That’s why I keep calling for a general boycott against posting content or comments on .ml communities.

!linux@programming.dev is a good alternative to !linux@lemmy.ml

load more comments (13 replies)
load more comments (11 replies)
[–] ikidd@lemmy.world 38 points 1 week ago (1 children)

The reasoning they give is ludicrous. That's idiotic as saying because someone put up a pedophile website, Apache is the devil. Even if Apache were built by NAMBLA, if it's opensource and doesn't randomly insert pictures of naked kids into your website, how does the developer matter to the product?

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] Flax_vert@feddit.uk 38 points 1 week ago (17 children)

Nutomic and Dessalines may be tankies, but they're our tankies

load more comments (17 replies)
[–] AI_toothbrush@lemmy.zip 38 points 1 week ago (6 children)

This is so stupid. Did everyone stop using ballpoint pens because the inventor was a nazi? No.

[–] Bob_Robertson_IX@discuss.tchncs.de 27 points 1 week ago (2 children)

but... I wouldn't drive a Tesla because of Elon Musk.

[–] AI_toothbrush@lemmy.zip 20 points 1 week ago

But by buying a tesla youre giving elon money and promoting his product which is much more closely tied to his views than lemmy is to the devs views.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (5 replies)
[–] DudeImMacGyver@sh.itjust.works 36 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Could you, like, maybe post the explanation we're supposed to be discussing for context instead of making us go search for it?

[–] LarsIsCool@lemmy.world 32 points 1 week ago (6 children)

Why was Lemmy removed from the list of fediverse alternatives?

Lemmy was removed due to:

Keep in mind that software is by no means "neutral". The people who make it make decisions about how it works based on their beliefs and goals. That's why, for example, you can't quote posts on Mastodon (at least for now), but you can do so on other fediverse platforms.

load more comments (6 replies)
[–] wpb@lemmy.world 29 points 1 week ago

"I'm gonna stop using GNU/Linux because I don't like Richard Stallman"

It's valid to dislike the devs (I disagree, I've found them nothing but courteous, and have read their posts with interest), but it's ridiculous to exclude their software from this list.

[–] avidamoeba@lemmy.ca 19 points 1 week ago (1 children)
[–] Blaze@feddit.org 21 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Yes, that's quite old, not sure why OP is bringing this up now.

Most of the people here know about the Lemmy devs political stances. Quite a few people are waiting for Piefed and Mbin to catch up. Nothing new to see here.

[–] teohhanhui@lemmy.world 16 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (8 children)

I don't know. I just came across it yesterday, and I thought it'd be something interesting to share.

It was explained in the post's body actually:

Curiously, it does not list Lemmy under the list of Reddit alternatives.

Most of the people here know about the Lemmy devs political stances.

Seeing as I've only started using Lemmy less than a month ago, I've only just very recently started realizing that.

[–] Blaze@feddit.org 16 points 1 week ago

It's okay, I see your account is quite new, so no worries.

As I said, those issues are known, you can have a look at !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com for posts complaining about power tripping mods, be it lemmy.ml or elsewhere.

The key takeaway is that even with its flaws, Lemmy is the biggest Reddit alternative by far (Discuit has less than 200 weekly active posters, Lemmy has 42000). If there would have been a better alternative people would probably have moved there, but there wasn't (and still isn't) any, so here we are

load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[–] TORFdot0@lemmy.world 17 points 1 week ago

It has mbin and piefed on the list, so it’s not harming the network at all. If anything it’s more healthy with more platforms rather than just ml and world. It’s one site directing people to the fedi, I’m not butthurt about it

[–] hono4kami@slrpnk.net 16 points 1 week ago (3 children)

I wrote this before

I spotted Dessalines posted literal propaganda on some community I joined

gotta be honest that does not sit well with me

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments
view more: next ›