I'm out of the loop here.
this post was submitted on 18 Sep 2024
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The west makes electronics which explode using security backdoors.
Secret backdoors... And planted plastic explosives.
Technological appliances which detonate using a classified method of activation.
That's not how batteries work (at least not with the results seen in this case).
Explosive electronic communication devices were allegedly produced in Hungaria.
[citation needed]
Hezbollah uses pagers for communication. Israel intercepted shipments of pagers and rigged them with bombs. Then, an unspecified amount of time later, Israel detonated them during the day, yanno, when people would be out and about in public places. Thousands of bombs went off across Lebanon and killed and injured children, elderly people, and adults.
Of course, mainstream media is trying to pretend that Israel didn't potentially commit what should be considered a warcrime while assholes on social media are spinning this as a masterfully precise and accurate strike that didn't have a considerable amount of collateral (I've literally seen someone say "only people with something to hide would be around a pager in this day and age" verbatim), and that anyone injured or killed was a member of Hezbollah.
Like, what if one of those had been on a plane when it went off?
When ISIS plants bombs on people and detonates them in public places then it's a bad thing. Israel does it and everyone stands, claps and tips everyone with $100% bills.
Edit: I honestly wonder if it's only a matter of time before some IDF or Mossad shithead hijacks a plane and flies it into the Burj Khalifa.
Not a war crime; terrorism. Hezbollah is a political organization.
Once again, it needs to be noted that this entire operation was designed to assassinate one guy. The part of the pager shipment was an order made by the Iranian consulate in Lebanon.
Since the Israelis didn't know which pager was going to the ambassador, they just rigged them all to explode. Then everyone who got caught in the crossfire was labeled "Hezbollah" after the fact.
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When ISIS bombs a public area, they're doing it to kill civilians. The target of this pager operation was clearly the people carrying the pagers.
I do agree there was some collateral, but it's difficult to get any more targeted on this scale.
Do it at night when people are going to bed. Send out a message to get people to check their pagers, then detonate them. There's still a chance of collateral, but it'd be significantly lower than detonating them when people will be out in public at the cost of what I imagine would be a slightly lower chance of hitting targets.
Last week I murdered an entire family of people across the street and started living in their house. One of their relatives came over and was all angry so I had to kill him and his entire family (human shields) because I needed to feel safe in my own home.
This is very complicated and you're stupid if you don't recognize that I've lived here since before I was born.
I'll agree that it's very complicated. But you also can't frame it like Hezbollah are the good guys. There are no good guys here.
Israel has done some horrible shit, including shooting at kneecaps for fun, not just pushing Palestinians off their land, but then actually settling that land, and treating Palestinians as a lesser people in general. But that doesn't just excuse constant shelling of Israel or the constant calls for genocide from either side. October 7th doesn't excuse what Israel's done in Gaza, and Gaza doesn't excuse October 7th. This shit doesn't just cancel out, like so many seem to want to believe.
** There is no good side in the middle east conflict. ** If you're solely defending and excusing one because of the attacks of the other, you're just as bad as they are. That's the reason they're in this mess; there's enough people always looking for revenge for the last revenge.
It seems to me that the general internet consensus frames the losing side as the scrappy underdog that is justified in all their actions. Even if the people defending "the innocent" don't believe that, guess how it's going to be read by people in and near the conflict.
I and this baby I murdered with my bare hands are exactly moral equivalents to each other. I broke into this child's house and murdered their entire family. That doesn't justify them feebly striking me with their soft baby fists. Nor does that attack on me justify how I murdered this helpless child with an ice pick. There are no good guys here.
If you're not condemning the helpless baby I murdered in terms as strong (or honestly more strong they are brown after all) terms as you condemn me, you're exactly as evil as "the innocent" brown child I just watched choke on blood because I punctured their little baby lungs.
People always act like I'm the bad guy just because I murdered an entire family and stole their home, and just because I'm infinitely bigger and stronger than the little baby, and because the little baby can only put up a token resistance to me killing them and everyone related to them. Just because they're the 'underdog'?? They lost fair and square! It's just so complicated! The baby kicked me in the crib with it's little baby feet while I was getting ready to stab it with my ice pick and make it bleed to death! It's a cycle of violence, not a genocide! I'm not a nazi! It's complicated!
Oh, and completely intentionally attacking aid workers and literally starving Gaza is absolutely genocide. And I do wish the US would pull back on their support for Israel (outside of an attack from Iran or similar).
I'm absolutely fine with the US shooting down missiles from Iran. We don't need to help Israel bomb Gaza. We absolutely could exert more control over Israel. But in the end, we don't control Israel, and the US is largely not responsible for every action they take. I'm sure the US had absolutely no part in this pager scheme, even if I do think it's a hell of a lot better than what Israel has done in Gaza.
If the social media consensus was the other way I'd be seen as attacking Israel. But let's see these people defending Hezbollah say anything negative about them.
And to be 1000% clear: Israel deserved October 7; they deserve a thousand of them.
Gaza doesn’t excuse October 7th
Yes it does. Just like every white person ever killed in a slave revolt. Just like every nazi killed in the Warsaw uprising.
And I count you among them.
Reporter: [REDACTED]
Reason: Violence
Good luck with that, reporter: Palestinian right of armed resistance
[UN] General Assembly resolution A/RES/38/17 (22/11/1983) stated that it "Reaffirms the legitimacy of the struggle of peoples for their independence, territorial integrity, national unity and liberation from colonial domination, apartheid and foreign occupation by all available means, including armed struggle".
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Bombing a police station because there's a chance one of the cops might try to arrest me.
Bombing the court house so there's no place for my trial.
Bombing the mayor's Special Committee On Investigating City Bombings to cover my trail.
Bombing the local field office of the newspaper that's writing a report on all these bombings.
More people are saying I'm the bad guy, but this is just adding the number of people I have to add to my list of future bomb targets.
they could've easily just targeted specific individuals (heads of staff, an ambassador apparently) instead of everyone with the pager. it would've been much more responsible to know who and where
they could’ve easily just targeted specific individuals
They did target a specific individual - the Iranian ambassador in Lebanon. Everyone else was collateral damage.
It really just proves the point though. Hardware at time of production is a major security risk and any side needs to be aware and protect themselves.
Can someone show me on a map where "the west" starts?
It's the big blob of central capitalism from when colonialism started to now. It's where the genocidal whites live, hence why Israel plays in the European soccer league.
Ah, so even though they're (trying to) occupy the exact same plot of land, Israel is "the west" (and therefore we're obligated to hate it) and Palestine is not (and therefore we're not). That makes sense now!
None of that makes sense. You don't have the writing chops to pull off a sentence with three clauses and three additional parenthetical clauses.
We're obligated to hate Israel and not Palestine because Israel is the settler colonial project currently engaged in genocide. It's very simple and no one has been opaque about it.
even though they’re (trying to) occupy the exact same plot of land
Explaining to my Cherokee friends that, really, you're no better than the European settlers who displaced you because you both wanted to live in Florida. Suddenly, they're not my friends anymore. Can't believe they were anti-white racists the whole time.
Where should Israel go back to then? What other land does it have claim to where it should stay?
Ah, right. Of course. You don't think Israel should exist at all. Judging by this comment I'm guessing you don't think the US should exist either, which means I don't have to listen to you
Where should Israel go back to then? What other land does it have claim to where it should stay?
Israel isn't a person. It can simply dissolve into nothing.
The people who moved there to take part in the land stealing can simply go back where they came. Or they can stay and live alongside the people they tried to genocide as equal citizens.
I'm sure the US government will be delighted to harbor all their war criminals above a certain station.
Not the person you're responding to
Obviously Israel shouldn't exist at all. It's not a diplomatically expedient thing to say, but it's the only real anti-colonialist answer because Israel is actively a colony. That doesn't mean expelling all the Jews from Palestine -- it might shock you to know there are non-Israeli Jews currently in Palestine -- but it does mean that the proper boarders for Palestine are restored and thus that there is no ethnostate (Jewish or otherwise). Recent additions to the Israeli colony (for they are always recruiting) can be sent back to their homelands. Many of them have been there long enough that they have no connection to those homelands anymore (including the more direct descendants of Holocaust survivors, etc.) and they can stay on the land that was Israel, but a lot of them are only there because they like the Jewish ethnostate thing and will therefore flee of their own will. That volume of people fleeing will probably incite still more to flee, but some will remain and they should be treated humanely and as equal citizens, prosecuting whatever crimes they committed but not being treated like subhumans the way that Israelis treated Palestinian prisoners.
The US is a much more difficult question because unlike Israelis being a minority compared to Palestinians, there are many more Euro-Americans, etc than there are Native Americans because the genocidal project of the US is much more complete. Inevitably some land, the land recently taken and some of the more useful land than what the Natives have been left with, should be returned to them, but obviously deporting all the Euros, etc. is neither viable nor productive, like how (to a much, much smaller extent) deporting all the Israelis is neither viable nor productive.
That said, separate from demographics and land rights, the US government absolutely shouldn't exist because it is terrorizing the world, including through proxies like Israel.
Where should Israel go back to then?
Israel doesn't have to go anywhere. No more than South Africa went somewhere after Apartheid ended in that state. Or Cuba vanished after the Batista government collapsed. Or Germany vanished after '45.
But the war criminals leading the current genocidal policy towards the people in their care. They need the same treatment as Milosoviec, Omar al-Bashir, and Saddam Hussein.
Drag Netanyahu to the Hague and prosecute him for crimes against humanity. Dismiss the current illegal and unconstitutional Kinesset and hold new free and fair elections in Israel. Provide reparations for the displaced Gaza and West Bank citizens, and launch a Truth and Reconciliation Committee to recover damages for the crimes committed against them.
That is the only moral path forward for Israel.
I'm not feeling too genocidal at the moment and I'm not too sure what a big blob of capitalism looks like but it sounds like you are impugning me (int al) in some way.
If you are going to deliver a stinging attack on something you dislike, why not deploy an impassioned and pithy argument rather than ... that. You do at least manage to spell it's correctly, which is nice.
Next time you aren't sure whether someone is being hostile or mean to you, just hold back on what your hypothetical response would be until you're sure what the intent was.
In my case I was earnestly answering the question. "The West" describes that continuation of institutional power which I described as a blob.
It's less a geographical or hemispheric distinction, and more a political one.
This page on imperial core is good.
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Hot take: that was the better military move by isreal than bombing 2000 women and children to kill 1 hezbula member, too bad they still killed children...
It would be strategically counterproductive for Israel if their stated intentions were true. This won't make hezbollah "uncouple" from Hamas.
The intention is really to start a war so big the US has to step in, which would be catastrophic for everyone, Israelis included.
Seems more like globalism is to blame. They were from a Taiwanese company but manufactured in Hungary.
Guessing the source of the pagers didn't matter at all and Israel probably intercepted a shipment to plant bombs in them themselves. Lithium batteries can ignite, but they don't just explode like that. There were bombs put in those pagers, be it by Israel or whoever else, coordinated as a targeted operation.
So it wasn't just here in Italy that they tried to make us believe it was just a cyber attack... On national tv they brought up an old man so called expert who said they probably disabilitated overheating protection remotely and somehow magically the battery exploded causing that damage ... I don't know if I need to interpret this as an attempt at psychological terrorism or just one of the usual diminishing policy in favor of Israel To be fair they mentioned the probability of an actual bomb but in my opinion such an obvious error must not be carried over especially world wide 😱 It gives me chills that the news industry could make such big errors also while talking about politics crime health ...
errors
Assuming it was totally inadvertent. Totally.
You can absolutely make a lipo battery "explode" by overheating it by drawing too much power. But it's the kind of explosion where it spews hot gas and maybe catches on fire. You'll definitely get hurt, but that's about it.
You can do MUCH worse by overcharging it. (note the size of that battery). There will eventually be a fireball if you overcharge it and keep overcharging it when it's already swollen to a balloon. But you generally don't charge stuff while it's in your pocket.
These were actual killing-people-explosions. Lipo batteries don't do that.
Yeah I know i think that everyone that has ever heard of Lipo fires and dangers with a basic Google search can distinguish between a lipo fire and a high explosive detonating ... Lipo are more like a jet of flames ( I had one in my 6 m^3 room wasn't nice but I'm here) yeah contained what you want It could be a bang, but to some extent... I don't know what you have seen but videos shown in my local news are impossible to explain with lipo fires ...
Can't find a link sorry
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Lipo's can absolutely burn your house down, but only while overcharging. Igniting a battery while you're walking around with it will at most burn your pants down, not kill you.
Exactly. I remember early days of smartphones before a lot of the safety precautions we have today were implemented, where we saw tons of videos of batteries spontaneously combusting. They expand, there's a pop, and then a small burst of flame that will ignite anything it touches, like your pants, tables they're sitting on while charging, etc. You can get pretty badly burned if this happens while it's in your pocket.
It's just that the videos that have come out of these pagers shows an actual explosion, as if they had been packed with C4. Enough to instantly kill some people with them on their person and harm adjacent passerbys.
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Lithium batteries can ignite, but they don't just explode like that.
These pagers don't use lithium battery.
So what other kind of battery would a pager be using that might explode if not lithium? Hydrogen cell?
(CH~2~N~2~O~2~)~3~
Not a battery but sure, that's what I was suggesting.
My point is that the lithium battery angel is a diversion and isn't even relevant.
Agreed
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