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How should I change my polite behavior to be more accommodating? (sh.itjust.works)

submitted 6 months ago by clay_pidgin@sh.itjust.works to c/asklemmy@lemmy.ml

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My parents raised me to always say "yes sir" and "no ma'am", and I automatically say it to service workers and just about anyone with whom I'm not close that I interact with. I noticed recently that I had misgendered a cashier when saying something like "no thank you, ma'am" based on their appearing AFAB, but on a future visit to the store they had added their pronouns (they) to their name tag. I would feel bad if their interaction with me was something they will remember when feeling down. This particular person has a fairly androgynous haircut/look and wears a store uniform, so there's no gender clue there.

I am thinking I need to just stop saying "sir" and "ma'am" altogether, but I like the politeness and I don't know how I would replace it in a gender-neutral way. Is there anything better than just dropping it entirely?

For background I'm a millennial and more than happy to use people's correct pronouns if I know them!

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[–] Soup@lemmy.world 23 points 6 months ago (1 children)

[preface: I got mad respect for you for wanting to find a solution here that works for everyone. Top-shelf stuff right there. The following is adding detail and not to berate you and I want to make sure that’s out there.]

People really don’t mind either way. The bar is on the floor with how conservatives are acting these days so simply respecting their pronouns will let them feel so much more human.

There are two kinds of respect I’ve experienced: the first is simply treating others kindly, fairly, and with patience and consideration. The second “formal politeness” is more often demanded than earned and it’s always based on stuff like “I’m older than you” because they don’t have anything else going for them. That deference is meant to make anyone who doesn’t treat them as special out to be “impolite” so they don’t need to back-up their decisions.

Most decent people don’t want the second kind of respect. I know for me it makes me feel icky thinking that someone has muted themselves because they’re afraid of making me angry. Mind you I don’t think poorly of anyone who says it, ever, because they’re just doing what they were taught and trying to be polite.

[–] twice_twotimes@sh.itjust.works 9 points 6 months ago (3 children)

Most decent people don’t want the second kind of respect. I know for me it makes me feel icky thinking that someone has muted themselves because they’re afraid of making me angry. Mind you I don’t think poorly of anyone who says it, ever, because they’re just doing what they were taught and trying to be polite.

Strong agree. I do not want to be shown deference if I’m not in an explicit position of authority and I do now want to shown respect if I haven’t earned it. (I also resent being asked to show deference or respect when it isn’t merited.) General politeness, like please and thank you, goes a long way toward demonstrating that you respect the person as an equal, which feels much more respectful to me than imposing some kind of arbitrary implied hierarchy of unearned respect between strangers.

[–] Nemo@midwest.social 5 points 6 months ago (1 children)

unearned respect

I suspect this here is where the break is. I don't think respect needs to be earned, I think all humans, all creatures, all things are worthy of respect by default. Sure, you can lose respect, but the default interaction with a stranger should be a respectful one.

[–] twice_twotimes@sh.itjust.works 7 points 6 months ago

I actually totally agree. All people should begin worthy of our respect simply because we are humans, and our language should reflect that. Where the break is for me is that (again, for me) honorifics and similar terms imply hierarchical respect or deference, and that’s where the “earned respect” comes in. My respect for you as an equal is yours to lose; my respect for you as superior is yours to earn. In my language community, regular old please and thank you communicate the first kind, while honorifics convey the second.

[–] Soup@lemmy.world 1 points 6 months ago

And it’s always demanded in completely unrelated ways, too. When you can’t be right or at least explain yourself, be a lil’ bitch.

“They’re older so you have to suck up.”

When ya got nothing left but the passage of time and a society that generally tries to keep you from dying…

“I’ve been doing this thing longer so I’m better.”

Only perfect practice makes perfect. You can suck at a thing for a real long time.

“They have more money so they’re smarter.”

We don’t have time for all the ways that’s false.

[–] Rivalarrival@lemmy.today 1 points 6 months ago

I feel the words sir and ma'am imply the degree of formality of the conversation rather than social hierarchy of the participants. I think it appropriate for a boss, customer, teacher, coach, judge, or adult to address a worker, waiter, student, player, litigant, or child as "sir" or "ma'am" , "Mister" or "Miss" until they have reached a certain degree of social familiarity justifying less formal language.