Asklemmy

It’s a disingenuous argument. The MP is from the Conservative Party, i.e., the right wing arsehole party.

You may have noticed how the Right Wing Playbook has been imported from America. Increasingly, when things aren’t going politically well, they’ll have a look at the Playbook and pick a Culture Wars trope. This is one such instance, intended only to divide.

which would presumably do similar things to the existsing minister for Women.

So very little then?

There shouldn't even have to be a Minister for Women!

I'm not British, but it would seem reasonable to me to have both. Men have issues too; and one of them is the social stigma attached to even acknowledging that fact or seeking help. People who pooh-pooh the idea might be doing so because of that stigma.

As an American whose only knowledge of UK government comes from sporadic episodes of Politics Unboringed, my first thought would be to replace the Minister for Women with a Minister for Gender Equality. They would have all the powers and responsibilities of the Minister for Women, and also gain any powers and responsibilities that a hypothetical Minister for Men would need.

• If there is a need for a Minister for Men, then that need is met by the Minister for Gender Equality
• If there is no need for a Minister for Men, then the only thing that changes is that the Minister for Women has a new, less controversial title

Sounds like a win-win to me, but again, I'm a dumb Yank lol

The official position is Minister for Women and Equalities.

And the easy answer to this Tory troll is that (middle-class, white) men already dominate political, economic and social life. Everything is filtered through the eyes of people like them, they don't need a special platform to get their viewpoint across.

But, this is a lot like March 8th (International Women's Day) being full of plaintive cries of "why isn't there an International Men's Day?". There is an International Men's Day and it is a very good thing. It makes sense in a way that "why isn't there a white history month?" does not.

There are many points of similarity and difference between the various forms of prejudice. And one of the things that makes sexism unique is that prejudice against women inevitably creates a mirror prejudice about (if not intentionally against) men. If being feminine means having emotions other than rage, men are allowed to experience only rage. If being feminine means caring for others, men are not allowed to care for (or about) others.

While there are certainly forms of feminism which are anti-men (most notably the transphobic strain currently getting more attention than it deserves), feminism is fundamentally as important for men as it is for women and the issues facing men exist precisely because of the history of subjugating women. Women's rights are not in tension with men's rights (unless you mean the demands of damaged and damaging men who insist that they should have the right to rape women and keep one at home as a sex doll, housekeeper, incubator and child minder).

This article is not perfect but it does make the broader point well: If I Admit That 'Hating Men' Is a Thing, Will You Stop Turning It Into a Self-Fulfilling Prophecy?:

Part Four: A List of "Men's Rights" Issues That Feminism Is Already Working On

Feminists do not want you to lose custody of your children. The assumption that women are naturally better caregivers is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not like commercials in which bumbling dads mess up the laundry and competent wives have to bustle in and fix it. The assumption that women are naturally better housekeepers is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want you to have to make alimony payments. Alimony is set up to combat the fact that women have been historically expected to prioritize domestic duties over professional goals, thus minimizing their earning potential if their "traditional" marriages end. The assumption that wives should make babies instead of money is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want anyone to get raped in prison. Permissiveness and jokes about prison rape are part of rape culture, which is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want anyone to be falsely accused of rape. False rape accusations discredit rape victims, which reinforces rape culture, which is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want you to be lonely and we do not hate "nice guys." The idea that certain people are inherently more valuable than other people because of superficial physical attributes is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want you to have to pay for dinner. We want the opportunity to achieve financial success on par with men in any field we choose (and are qualified for), and the fact that we currently don't is part of patriarchy. The idea that men should coddle and provide for women, and/or purchase their affections in romantic contexts, is condescending and damaging and part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want you to be maimed or killed in industrial accidents, or toil in coal mines while we do cushy secretarial work and various yarn-themed activities. The fact that women have long been shut out of dangerous industrial jobs (by men, by the way) is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want you to commit suicide. Any pressures and expectations that lower the quality of life of any gender are part of patriarchy. The fact that depression is characterized as an effeminate weakness, making men less likely to seek treatment, is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want you to be viewed with suspicion when you take your child to the park (men frequently insist that this is a serious issue, so I will take them at their word). The assumption that men are insatiable sexual animals, combined with the idea that it's unnatural for men to care for children, is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want you to be drafted and then die in a war while we stay home and iron stuff. The idea that women are too weak to fight or too delicate to function in a military setting is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want women to escape prosecution on legitimate domestic violence charges, nor do we want men to be ridiculed for being raped or abused. The idea that women are naturally gentle and compliant and that victimhood is inherently feminine is part of patriarchy.

Feminists hate patriarchy. We do not hate you.

If you really care about those issues as passionately as you say you do, you should be thanking feminists, because feminism is a social movement actively dedicated to dismantling every single one of them. The fact that you blame feminists—your allies—for problems against which they have been struggling for decades suggests that supporting men isn't nearly as important to you as resenting women. We care about your problems a lot. Could you try caring about ours?

There should be minister for equality. Dividing is making more conflicts.

To advocate for men's services like mental healthcare, regular healthcare, and things like that. And by regular healthcare I mean the stigma around going to the doctor, not access. To advocate for men who've been abused physically, emotionally, sexually etc? Yeah. I'm all for that.

Some people are making a slippery slope argument. That then we would need one for each other gender identity etc. And you know what. We should have those too. If you're not trans there is a limit to how much you can understand (not empathize, but understand) the challenges that face trans people. Same thing with men, and with women. And everyone should have equal representation and advocacy. Does.it seem bloated? Sure. Does it seem like the kind of thing that might get out of hand? Or might be taken advantage of, or might end up devaluing the authority of the ruling body? Maybe. But it's better to attempt equality and equity and fail and then try again than it is to not attempt it because it's "problematic.

I don't know what the female counterpart does in this role. I don't live in the UK and so I had to imagine what a person in the role of Woman's Minister would do. What their duties would be. And then translate that to something that a Men's Minister would do. And what I came up with (as a woman) was very telling to me that I don't know a lot about the challenges men face in society. But I do know that toxic masculinity and the taboo of seeking both mental and other types of healthcare exist. And I would love to see someone attempt to fight those at a government level for the benefit of citizens the way so many governments want protect women, and their rights (laws against rape, sexuql harrassment, sexual assault, programs both government and private to benefit battered woman, healthcare services that include abortion and family planning and so on).

Here's a question for people who do live there, especially the ones who say the representative in this role doesn't do anything. What are they supposed to do? Would there be consequences of that role was eliminated?

This entire gender discussion is just to engage people and make them care about politics.

No different than social media algorithms designed to make people angry so they engage.

Keeps the peasants fighting and arguing about pointless things. My advice to people in this thread is to ask yourself if the rich owners actually cares about your gender and what they can do to make you feel better.

Seems like a smart idea. Minister of women focusing on issues specifically women face and miniter of men for specifically male issues. Seems like an alright idea

Right wing politician claiming to care about men's rights and sexism? Sure. This is just another attempt to distract people from the real problems within the government. There should be a single social equalities minister, which is what the role already is, really. It just so happens that misogyny is literally everywhere in the world and that men (as a man myself) are advantaged in numerous ways. Imagine being a woman in Pakistan.

There are some social stigmas and problems from cultural beliefs, such as the idea 'men don't feel' and other bs, but in truth anyone with a brain realises how invalid these arguments are. What we actually need is better education and access to information, so people don't fall into this shit in the first place and can see through the flaws of people around them and not follow into conformism blindly. If anything, the idea of having a male counterpart is just serving to further the divide by continuing to separate people based on superficial qualities. If you really want to end sexism, you need to treat people as equals regardless of sex, and to get others to do the same. It will require lots of activism to do so because far too many people hold discriminatory beliefs towards both sexes that they are taught from a young age and hold emotionally rather than logically.

From what I have observed, so many people claiming to care or talking about 'men's rights' really just have a victim-complex and are very emotionally immature. It's all too often the same people who cry about women being bitches or being shameless onlyfans models. For all the problems women face, it's barely even comparable. That isn't to invalidate sexism against men, but just to mean that they are not even nearly close in terms of discrimination experienced.

At some point yes. The lack of tackling men's issues is not due to a lack of representation. Roles like this are specifically about opinions that are not being heard or represented before the creation of the role. Once the need for other roles presents itself, those roles will be created as well. Well... after the need has presented itself for so long that it has gained enough traction to actually have a chance of the idea surviving the proposal. And then only a few more short decades.

It's similar, though not the same, to specifically increasing diversity on purpose in business. The counter argument that hiring "the best candidate blindly" would be a better strategy misses that diversity adds it's own value. The person who is almost as qualified, but brings a background not currently represented in the company does indeed bring more value. It is understandably seen as inherently unfair, but it wouldn't be so valuable if we weren't coming from such a staggering lack of diversity. So the fix to historical unfairness, is a bit more unfairness but in the other direction. If it works, there will be no reason to focus on it eventually. It will just be normal.

Men are a serious fucking problem, and it’s time an elected official took ownership of the issue and dealt with it decisively.

When Ken wants a Minister to compete with Barbie