Fediverse

Conservative and/or right wing, authoritarian, reactionary (feel free to pick your favorite analogous label) views are ethically wrong and lack evidence to add a worthy perspective to discussions. Capitalism is a belief and should be discussed as other religions.

There is no such thing as a "moderate conservative" any more. IMO the difference has always been mainly, how mask off they were prepared to go. Trump has shown them that you can go fully mask off without any negative consequences.

Seems like lemmy.world already provides plenty of right wing perspectives, we really don't need me.

I don’t think having Nazis and Zionists here would make anything better, make anyone sympathize with them, or find common ground. This is a place where we can be safe, why add people who are purposefully being dishonest and spreading disinformation? They aren’t misinformed people, they are real pieces of shit who hold a genuinely wrong position/s; they want to piss you off to ruin your day. I already have enough discourse with these people everywhere else, why here?

I think the problem is in the opposite direction. Society is too ideologically homogeneous in being against socialism. The major narratives are controlled by nation-states and corporations, social media are infested with political advertisement and propaganda.

So, as others say, I believe it is sorta uninformed and middle-of-the-road fallacy to find a corner of the internet where you can speak your mind without being harassed by white supremacist trolls, and say we need more diverse views.

Right wingers have (had) Parlel, Gap, TruthSocial, now they have X, and Facebook, where they were also dominating and harassing in the past. No leftists and/or genderqueer person would survive a day at these platforms.

But Lemmy being primarily/explicitly leftist is the problem, and you suddenly are alarmed for echo chambers. This is not quite fair, now is it.

As for Lemmy per se, I don't think it is too homogeneous. I debate centrists and liberals every other day. And recent discussions showed that the amount of latent transphobia in the site is shocking, with people knowing next to nothing apart from 4chan/MAGA talking points.

How can this happen after all these years of activism and outreach. It is because of the ecosystem of echo chambers in the broader communications and media landscape. This discourse never reached those people.

Considering it was the position of major medical and professional organizations, it shows that the pathology lies with the existing social media and broader media enterprizes, with a prominently selective messaging.

Do I need to say that this led to widespread science-denialism for which mainstream platforms are clearly to blame?

If your inquiry is honest, then the only explanation is that the propaganda apparatus works so well, that the (relative) absence of the dominating narratives makes you anxious that you entered an echo chamber, when in fact you probably have been in an echo chamber so far.

I wish lemmy had more niche interest groups, like marvel champions card game. Then there'd be something to talk about that isn't how we should force others to give a percetage of their earnings to the goxernment.

1. Yes

2. Yes

3. Yes

• Yes

• Yes

• Maybe; yes

• It's a mindset thing. The more you interact with others positively while disagreeing, the better things will get. This only applies to reasonable disagreements.

• People will learn more, but people will be wrong more. Unchecked political diversity drives away normal takes. No political diversity makes people afraid to voice disagreement.

I don't understand this thought process. If the far left is preaching facts and kindness, and the other side is literally Nazies we need more left homogeneous thinking. We need to get educated and organized about the issues facing humanity. When the far left starts to be anti science and facts then you can begin to worry.

There's a lot of stuff written on this topic, but I haven't seen this mentioned yet: there are conservative instances on Lemmy, as a platform. Most of them are widely defederated, not necessarily for the views of the majority (though in some cases, yes), but because of asshats deliberately causing trouble.

Unfortunately, this is also a product of a wider shift in discourse by the right (understood in a North American context), which appeals mostly to edgelords rather than the (rapidly shrinking, already shrunk to the point of irrelevance/non-existence one could argue) thinking, at least ostensibly humanistic conservative.

There's self-selection in action here. Which makes sense, even if I also find it troubling (there are people who can be reasoned with drowned out by Nazi assholes, who are willing to hear people out on the not-Nazi stuff, give positive reinforcement and with it a home to get radicalized).

I don't have a good answer, and if I did I'd probably be up for a Nobel Prize given how wide and damaging the problem is. It ain't just here - it's pretty much anywhere anyone expresses any idea. I just happen to like this side of the Threadiverse much more, so it's where I hang out.

Only real hope is meatspace, imo. And even then, not everyone has the privilege to engage this way in meatspace without a direct risk to their personal safety (see POC, our trans brothers and sisters, LGTBQ+ folks, etc.).

Two big problems are

, when you talk with the Right, you don’t have to dig very deep before you encounter dishonesty.

When you talk with Liberals, they are not politically aware at all

The thing about the right wing is that it always boils down to the cruelty being the point. People play it up -just- being a difference of opinion like we're talking about whether or not pineapple is good on pizza; when the opinions in question are that brown people are inferior, trans people people don't deserve rights, a woman's life is worth less than a fetus, etc: there's no valuable dialogue to be had. Ban the fucker and don't look back.

The closest thing to valuable dialogue you're going to get with that garbage is the bullshit veneer they slap onto their vitriol to make it easier to sell - the whole white knight bit about protecting babies or bathrooms or some other nonsense that conveniently lands the same outgroups into a bind every single time. If you think any of that shit is in good faith, you've fallen for a trap before the conversation even starts.

Diversity of thought is great, up until we start turning to hatred/bigotry for a fresh perspective. Those are not welcome here, nor should they be anywhere else.

Not counting lemmygrad and hexbear most of lemmy instances is completely liberal, at best radical liberal. I seriously doubt your statement about being communist if you call for more centrism and think we need more rightwing info.

You want more rightwing? Go anywhere else in the internet, there's full of it everywhere. What is lacking everywhere else, is communist point of view.

Reason and Science has always a left leaning bias. Simply because Nature doesn't give a shit about individual feelings or if someone believes if homosexuality is wrong. Nature does it's thing an humans who accept and understand this are not left-leaning but normal.

Corporate Social Media is manipulated like hell to shift the bias. That's it.

There are many posts preaching for the choir, but I wouldn't call it an echo chamber. It's more like a dead sound chamber where the ideas dies in agreement. It doesn't bounce off the walls or resonate. It's already there so no answer is required.

Lemmy would benefit from more users playing the devil's lawyer, but I think it's too small for anyone to use their main profile for that, and alt-accounts would quickly get blocked or banned.

Actual users with opposing views wouldn't be of much help. Politics isn't very nuanced these days. It's not red or blue, left or right or whatever. It's polarized into a new duality: Those that give a shit and those who are proud idiots. Lemmy is on the good side of this and will not benefit from being more accepting of idiots.

I find circles around .world to be more liberal and not leftist. (Not that there aren't any on .world... Just leans that way)

There's not much in terms of right wing spaces but tbh I'm uh, completely fine with that.

Participating in this thread had left me feeling like lemmy is much more of an echo chamber than what I thought before.

I like being disagreed with on occasion, but don't feel like anyone really listened here. That is very internet but also pretty concerning.

1. Yes I noticed this too
2. It already is, which is a shame
3. Yes it's a problem because even if you try to get a balanced amount of all the views in your Lemmy subscriptions it's not possible, at the same time bubbles radicalize people.
4. Let discussions happen, don't delete and ban because you're against the view (as long as it's not continuously spamming)
5. Benefit: You see people as humans even if they are wrong, Drawback: you need to sometimes change your mind in face of new evidence showing up, which it wouldn't if you stay in your bubble.

The thing which I really dislike with a bubble is that people inside of it get more and more radical and ban even their allies because they're not radical enough.

@Teknevra
I'm not a part of Lemmy, but I will say this: There are some people with whom reasonable dialog is just not possible. Speaking only for myself, I choose not to engage. That does not mean I'm not aware of what they are saying or thinking. It means that I am drawing a healthy boundary for myself.

Your feelings about it are valid. You should absolutely seek out more mixed spaces, if that is what you want to do.

Cheers!