this post was submitted on 26 Sep 2024
81 points (93.5% liked)

News

23367 readers
3121 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil

Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.

2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.

Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.

3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.

Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.

4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.

Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.

5. Only recent news is allowed.

Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.

6. All posts must be news articles.

No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.

7. No duplicate posts.

If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.

8. Misinformation is prohibited.

Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.

9. No link shorteners.

The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.

10. Don't copy entire article in your post body

For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
rjc@lemmy.world
Thekingoflorda@lemmy.world
Tenthrow@lemmy.world
JonsJava@lemmy.world
gedaliyah@lemmy.world
little_cow@lemmy.world
jeffw@lemmy.world
enu@lemmy.world
81
Pakistani Maulana Who Advocated 'Death For Blasphemy' Now On The Run For 'Blasphemous Remarks' Over Alleged Errors In Quran (swarajyamag.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Live_Let_Live@lemmy.world to c/news@lemmy.world
15 comments fedilink hide all child comments
all 17 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] Sundial@lemm.ee 23 points 1 month ago (1 children)

A video of him went viral where he can be seen saying, "Why are you following Nabi (Mohammad, Prophet of Islam) when he did not know how to read and write?"

"The one (Mohammad) who is presenting the Quran (holy book of Islam), did not even write a single word and called others to write for him, which led to grammatical mistakes," he added.

"No corrections were done because Mohammad did not know there were grammatical errors, which continue till today," the Maulana said highlighting grammatical errors in the Quran.

Notably, the Maulana used to urge Muslims to kill anyone 'immediately' who disrespects Mohammad or Quran, without taking the case to court.

That's just an incredible level of stupidity that I don't even have words for.

[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 3 points 1 month ago (1 children)

"No corrections were done because Mohammad did not know there were grammatical errors, which continue till today," the Maulana said highlighting grammatical errors in the Quran.

Huh??? Okay this has to be the most absurd criticism of Islam I've ever seen.

[–] Sundial@lemm.ee 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Honestly, this is pretty mild compared to other criticisms of the religion you can find online lol.

[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I mean it is, but others at least make sense. I of course don't think they're correct, being a Muslim, but I can at least understand why someone would think that way. Meanwhile this is just... uh... What? Does this guy even understand that the study of Arabic grammar studied so non-Muslims could understand the Quran. It's literally impossible for the Quran to contain Arabic grammar mistakes (let alone how Islam would have never spread if the core of its beliefs was such sloppy work).

[–] Sundial@lemm.ee 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Some Quran books have minor "corrections" in the sense that certain letters or accents on letters are changed. I believe it was meant to accommodate the dialect(s) at the time and was accepted since it didn't actually change the meaning. Definitely doesn't justify this guys stupidity though.

[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 1 points 1 month ago

So I'll ramble a bit here.

We call those readings of the Quran, and they're all proven (up to sahih hadith standards) to come from Muhammed himself. These aren't changes that came with dialect (all of Quran is written in Classical Arabic, or the dialect of Arabic spoken in Mecca and its surroundings at the time of Muhammed), and in fact there was more diversity in how the Quran was recited in the past before Caliph Othman ordered everyone to burn down all Qurans that don't follow the Meccan dialect to avoid strife in the Caliphate. I can go into more detail if you want, but what I want to say that these differences are "built in" so to speak, and are not any sort of gotcha.

[–] ephrin@sh.itjust.works 23 points 1 month ago

That guy: Man, I never thought that leopard would eat MY face!

[–] cygnus@lemmy.ca 17 points 1 month ago (3 children)

On some level, he isn't wrong. It's all transcribed speeches, sort of like how we have no surviving writings of Aristotle, only notes taken by students during his lectures, or of course like the new testament which is a compendium of books written by people ranging from a few years after Jesus' death all the way out to a century thereafter.

[–] xmunk@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Since this article is about pedantry I'd like to point out that I believe you meant to reference Socrates not Aristotle there - Socrates believed that education came through dialog and committing words to paper made them "dead" and open to misinterpretation. Socrates was essentially afraid that people would read words of his and pick apart technicalities so he preferred to teach people orally and then have those people teach others.

Plato may have committed some of these conversations to writing after the fact, though Plato may have also just used Socrates as a mouth piece to express his own idea. I'd classify both Plato and Socrates as chill... Aristotle on the other hand absolutely lacked any chill.

Aristotle wrote a lot and wrote it to achieve political gains - his philosophy was the one primarily embraced by Western Europe and is deeply flawed with a lot of extra built in misogyny (Plato was relatively progressive but still has some built in misogyny) and other bullshit. We do have surviving writing as notes from his students but most of his writing is actually his own.

[–] cygnus@lemmy.ca 7 points 1 month ago

Aristotle wrote a lot

He did, but none of those writings survived to make it to us. All of his extant "works" are in fact lecture notes taken by his students. The Penguin translation of Nicomachean Ethics for example is beautifully done in a way that makes that very evident.

[–] RustyShackleford@programming.dev 1 points 1 month ago

What writings should I read to see examples of "built-in misogyny" (I've only read The Republic way back in undergrad)?

[–] palordrolap@fedia.io 3 points 1 month ago

Pretty sure I've heard or read that the Quran is supposed to be the literal word of God and any human who was holding the pen was merely a conduit.

Therefore any mistakes are not, in fact, mistakes because God is infallible and that would be impossible. As such, we should amend our own grammar to match the Quran and not the other way around.

Anyone who suggests otherwise should be dealt with accordingly.

I'm not saying I agree with this logic, only that there is a perverse kind of sense to it.

As for "but it's written one way in one paragraph and in another way in another paragraph" well you'll just have to derive what context is responsible for the change in grammar and adjust yourself accordingly. Consult your local mullah. But be careful how you ask your question or you might end up on the run.

(May I suggest claiming you were confused by a different dialect of Arabic.)

[–] some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org 12 points 1 month ago

So sad when what goes around comes around. /s

[–] Kyrgizion@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Satire is stone cold dead. Reality jumped the shark.

[–] FaceDeer@fedia.io 1 points 1 month ago

Satire wouldn't be satire if it wasn't based on reality.