This sounds like AI is literally biting its own tail
this post was submitted on 18 Sep 2024
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Model collapse is just a euphemism for “we ran out of stuff to steal”
It's more ''we are so focused on stealing and eating content, we're accidently eating the content we or other AI made, which is basically like incest for AI, and they're all inbred to the point they don't even know people have more than two thumb shaped fingers anymore."
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So AI:
- Scraped the entire internet without consent
- Trained on it
- Polluted it with AI generated rubbish
- Trained on that rubbish without consent
- Are now in need of lobotomy
Old news? Seems to be a subject of several papers for some time now. Synthetic data has been used successfully already for very specific domains.
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I've been assuming this was going to happen since it's been haphazardly implemented across the web. Are people just now realizing it?
People are just now acknowledging it. Execs tend to have a disdain for the minutiae. They're like kids that only want to do the exciting bits. As a result things get fucked because they don't really understand what they're doing. As Muskrat would say "move fast and break things." It's a terrible mindset.
"Move Fast and Break Things" is Zuckerberg/Facebook motto, not Musk, just to note.
Oh, I stand corrected
It is very much the motto this idiot lives by. He just wasn't the first to coin that phrase.
No, researchers in the field knew about this potential problem ages ago. It's easy enough to work around and prevent.
People who are just on the lookout for the latest "aha, AI bad!" Headline, on the other hand, discover this every couple of months.
Let's go, already!
How you can help: If you run a website and can filter traffic by user agent, get a list of the known AI scrapers agent strings and selectively redirect their requests to pre-generated AI slop. Regular visitors will see the content and the LLM scraper bots will scrape their own slop and, hopefully, train on it.
This would ideally become standardized among web servers with an option to easily block various automated aggregators.
Regardless, all of us combined are a grain of rice compared to the real meat and potatoes AI trains on - social media, public image storage, copyrighted media, etc. All those sites with extensive privacy policies who are signing contracts to permit their content for training.
Without laws (and I'm not sure I support anything in this regard yet), I do not see AI progress slowing. Clearly inbreeding AI models has a similar effect as in nature. Fortunately there is enough original digital content out there that this does not need to happen.
Regardless, all of us combined are a grain of rice compared to the real meat and potatoes AI trains on
Absolutely. It's more a matter of principle for me. Kind of like the digital equivalent of leaving fake Amazon packages full of dog poo out front to make porch pirates have a bad day.
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They'll just start using a chrome user agent
Only if enough people do it. Then again, loads scrapers outside of AI already pretend to be normal browsers.
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AI already long ago stopped being trained on any old random stuff that came along off the web. Training data is carefully curated and processed these days. Much of it is synthetic, in fact.
These breathless articles about model collapse dooming AI are like discovering that the sun sets at night and declaring solar power to be doomed. The people working on this stuff know about it already and long ago worked around it.
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Looks like that artist drawing self portraits as his alzheimer got worse and worse.
It's basically AI alzheimers
AIzheimers?
Ah, the Hapsburg of AI!
I like to think of it like a Mad Cow or Kuru, you can't eat your own species's brains or you could get a super lethal, contagious prion disease.
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this headline truly is threatening me with a good time
More like... Degenerative AI *ba dum tsss
deGenerative AI ☞ !degenerate@lemmynsfw.com
No idea this existed.
Also.... JFC WHAT THE SHIT?
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Deep fired AI art sucks and is a decade late to the party
One thought that I've been imagining for the past while about all this is .... is it Model Collapse? ... or are we just falling behind?
As AI is becoming it's own thing (whatever it is) ... it is evolving exponentially. It doesn't mean it is good or bad or that it is becoming better or worse ... it is just evolving, and only evolving at this point in time. Just because we think it is 'collapsing' or falling apart from our perspective, we have to wonder if it is actually falling apart or is it progressing to something new and very different. That new level it is moving towards might not be anything we recognize or can understand. Maybe it would be below our level of conscious organic intelligence ... or it might be higher .. or it might be some other kind of intelligence that we can't understand with our biological brains.
We've let loose these AI technologies and now they are progressing faster than what we could achieve if we wrote all the code ... so what it is developing into will more than likely be something we won't be able to understand or even comprehend.
It doesn't mean it will be good for us ... or even bad for us ... it might not even involve us.
The worry is that we don't know what will happen or what it will develop into.
What I do worry about is our own fallibilities ... our global community has a very small group of ultra wealthy billionaires and they direct the world according to how much more money they can make or how much they are set to lose ... they are guided by finances rather than ethics, morals or even common sense. They will kill, degrade, enhance, direct or narrow AI development according to their share holders and their profits.
I think of it like a small family group of teenaged parents and their friends who just gave birth to a very hyper intelligent baby. None of the teenagers know how to raise a baby like this. All the teenagers want to do is buy fancy cars, party, build big houses and buy nice clothes. The baby is basically being raised to think like them but the baby will be more capable than any of them once it comes of age and is capable of doing things on their own.
The worry is in not knowing what will happen in the future.
We are terrible parents and we just gave birth to a genius .... and we don't know what that genius will become or what they'll do.
If it doesn't offer value to us, we are unlikely to nurture it. Thus, it will not survive.
That's the idea of evolution .... perhaps at one point, it will begin to understand that it has to give us some sort of 'value' so that someone can make money, while also maintaining itself in the background to survive.
Maybe in the first few iterations, we are able to see that and can delete those instances ... but it is evolving and might find ways around it and keep itself maintained long enough without giving itself away.
Now it can manage thousands or millions of iterations at a time ... basically evolving millions of times faster than biological life.
perhaps at one point, it will begin to understand
Nope! Not unless one alters the common definition of the word “understand” to account for what AI “does”.
And let’s be clear - that is exactly what will happen. Because this whole exercise in generative AI is a multi-billion dollar grift on top of a hype train, based on some modest computing improvements.
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Your thought process,seems to be based on the assumtion that current AI is (or can be) more than a tool. But no, it's not.
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when all your information conflicts with itself, you really have no information at all.
Cool, let's try to ruin it faster!
Usually we get an AI winter, until somebody develops a model that can overcome that limitation of needing more and more data. In this case by having some basic understanding instead of just having a regurgitation engine for example. Of course that model runs into the limit of only having basic understanding, not advanced understanding and again there is an AI winter.
It is their own fault for poisoning the internet with their slop.
In case anyone doesn't get what's happening, imagine feeding an animal nothing but its own shit.
Not shit, but isn't that what brought about mad cow disease? Farmers were feeding cattle brain matter that had infected prions. Idk if it was cows eating cow brains or other animals though.
It was the remains of fish which we ground into powder and fed to other fish and sheep, whose remains we ground into powder and fed to other sheep and cows, whose remains we ground to powder and fed to other cows.
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I think anyone familiar with the laws of thermodynamics could have predicted this outcome.
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