this post was submitted on 28 Jul 2024
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[–] skulblaka@sh.itjust.works 0 points 3 months ago (13 children)

I dream of an open source car. Something simple but reliable, say a legally-distinct 2004 Honda Accord, bog standard, no frills, no detail package options, just A Cheap Car with standardized parts and open source software. It's the only car the company makes, you can buy one for 10k or build your own for 6k out of parts and a couple months worth of weekends, car nerds will fork the software for infinite tuning customization, and it doesn't report your location back to headquarters. Parts are standardized across every car we've ever made so your local parts store will have them in stock. The new model year is the same car as last year, we just built some fresh ones for people to buy new.

I have no way of making this dream a reality. But I dream of it nonetheless. American car culture has gone off the rails, and the number of people I see already driving around old 5-owner Hondas and Toyotas and Buicks tells me that there is definitely a market for a cheap basic car that runs.

[–] ApollosArrow@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I assume car manufacturers would try to stop this by saying people would just load up video games or netflix on their dashboards while they drive. Even though you could probably do that now already, if you really wanted to.

[–] laurelraven@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Hell, I could just bolt a laptop to the dash if I really wanted that

[–] Saik0Shinigami@lemmy.saik0.com 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Why jump to laptop when tablets are right there? Just chuck one of these chungus fuckers onto some velcro mounts...https://www.samsung.com/us/mobile/tablets/galaxy-view/samsung-galaxy-view-18-4-32gb-wi-fi-black-sm-t670nzkaxar/

[–] laurelraven@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Yeah, but who wants their car to look like a Tesla? ;)

[–] Saik0Shinigami@lemmy.saik0.com 0 points 3 months ago

What do you mean? You still have your dash cluster!

[–] InFerNo@lemmy.ml 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

That would have been the Sono Sion, but there was too little interest. Not enough preorders meant they ran out of money to continue development.

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[–] frezik@midwest.social 0 points 3 months ago

Creating a FOSS EV is all do-able right now with off the shelf motors and batteries. Welding a frame would take some skill. How to title it would depend on the local government rules; many states in the US have a kit car designation for this sort of thing, but not all do.

If it's built rigid like a race car with a roll cage, four-point harness, and at least a DOT rated helmet for everyone inside (if not Snell), it could be safer then most cars on the road. If it's not very large, then it's probably safer for pedestrians and bicycles, too.

I don't expect air bags to be viable. It takes a lot of tuning to get them right, and they can be worse than nothing if not done right (they're basically a controlled explosion). However, the race car-like design above, plus helmets, would keep you safer than any air bag. Road cars converted to track cars often disable or remove the air bags. The rules of the event may even require it. They're counterproductive dead weight when you're packed in this way.

Other creature comforts are going to be what you put into it, but keep in mind that many of the things we take for granted in modern cars--A/C, stereos, padded seats, etc.--add a whole lot of weight.

What also adds weight is how many passengers you want to carry at once. Two passengers won't add much weight, but four or more would. All that extra frame material adds up.

Building a traditional frame would take some welding skills. I have just enough welding skills to make some shelves, but anything structural (which my tutor defined as "anything where somebody's life depends on the weld holding") is not something I'm comfortable doing. That is to say, it'll take more than a quick tutorial and a little practice.

However, one interesting possibility is epoxy. Lotus did this for the Elise, and I once tracked down the epoxy manufacturer they use (I'd have to search around to find it again, though). The instructions for it didn't seem to need anything particularly out of reach for a hobbyist (doesn't need a big autoclave or anything like that). Lotus did reinforce certain sections with bolts/rivets. It will take some knowledge to design a frame around this, but it's one time design work by an engineer and then everyone can copy it.

One advantage Lotus had over a welded frame was thinner material. A weld itself is very strong, but it weakens the metal around it (meaning you usually get breaks around the weld, not on it). You have to use thicker metal to compensate for that. Since Lotus was using an epoxy, they could use thinner material for less weight, and it was stronger in the end.

Since it's also getting rid of a whole lot of weight around the frame, the range you get out of those batteries could be extreme. It could also be extremely quick with a modest motor.

This is basically all to say that you can have any three: safe, creature comforts, enough space for passengers, range.

[–] markon@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago

Yeah I want my autonomous electric town car to be fully open. We should be able to have sustainable cars if any cars at all. Cars you can't easily repair or maintain are not sustainable.

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[–] histic@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 3 months ago (8 children)

And this is why I drive a 1980 Volkswagen rabbit pickup. better gas mileage then modern cars (50mpg+ on the highway) I can replace about any part in it for under a few hundred in most cases even a new engine can be done under 1000. And everything is dead simple to work on no fancy computers or anything.

[–] AA5B@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (2 children)

How about those crumple zones? Feel safe in your passenger cage? Hope you’re shorter than the dashboard in case of a rollover. Don’t have to worry about getting hit by those airbags, do you? Imagine that steering column spearing through your chest

New cars aren’t just about the latest infotainment, gadgets, and design. There have been huge improvements in pollution control and safety. There has also been huge improvements in efficiency, even if they’re masked by the increased weight of safety improvements, increased performance, and generally much larger size. So far a lot of that increased complexity is well worth it - I’ll never have another car without anti-lock brakes

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[–] todd_bonzalez@lemm.ee 0 points 3 months ago (3 children)

Cars should just come with a big open socket up front, where I can buy (or build) my own infotainment system to install there. That way I can replace it over the course of the car's lifetime. Or, give me the option to just plug it up or install a traditional car radio or something. I should be able to cram an 8-track player in if I want.

Keep all automobile controls as physical buttons, knobs, and levers.

I haven't owned a car in over 10 years, but whenever I look at what's available, I can't get past how much planned obsolescence is baked into newer cars. I would never buy one...

If automakers focused on cars, and let tech companies and focus on building the infotainment systems, we'd have better choices and less vendor lock-in.

[–] Omniraptor@lemm.ee 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I may be weird but why would you need an infotainment system at all? I have all the infotainment I could possibly want in my phone, the car is only needed as a Bluetooth speaker and for standard playback controls.

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[–] noughtnaut@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Cars should just come with a big open socket up front, where I can buy (or build) my own infotainment system to install there.

...which is precisely what we used to have, before auto makers decided to insist that they should be enclosed in a swooping dash.

[–] todd_bonzalez@lemm.ee 0 points 3 months ago

I'd be fine with a reinvention of the modular system with more digital I/O and connections to other features of the car. Let me buy something like a "Samsung Galaxy Drive" infotainment dash that embodies the "swooping dash" concept, or let me buy a pre-built shell that I can build out like a custom PC.

I can cram my car full of corporate apps, or I can run it on Linux. I would love to have the choice.

Any future self-driving capabilities need to be inside of their own dedicated system like an aircraft autopilot.

[–] BigPotato@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago

I mean, the DIN hole was a standard size but it certainly wasn't a 'socket' and anyone who had a Ford Focus that needed a Mercedes-Benz writing harness to plug up their aftermarket radio knows what I'm on about.

[–] AA5B@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

That was also the point of Apple CarPlay/Android auto. Let the manufacturer provide the hardware but your phone can run the infotainment. Let actual software companies do that, instead of the horrible mess that car manufacturers make out of software

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[–] skymtf@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 3 months ago

In general for me, I think mission critical systems breaks, engine etc should be physically isolated from the infotainment system. Infotainment systems should also prioritize using off the shelf hardware and running stuff like android, also prioritize android auto and apple car play, since these can be updated without automaker input for the most part.

[–] NauticalNoodle@lemmy.ml 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (5 children)

Cellular enabled cars are conceptually dumb. That's a hill I'm willing to die on.

[–] ZarkleFarkle@sh.itjust.works 0 points 3 months ago

Me when my car gets hack and remote controlled to drive off a cliff:

"Ahhh" D: sploosh

[–] kalleboo@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (4 children)

Naw, I live in a hot as hell country I'm super jealous of people who can remote-start the air conditioning in their cars.

It should be an open interface like OBD2 though where you can choose the hardware/provider instead of being locked to the car manufacturer deprecating everything in 3 years to sell you a new car.

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[–] fury@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago (7 children)

How is the 3G sunset not solvable by just swapping out a modem module for an LTE or 5G one and maybe installing some new modem firmware? A lot of cars are running a Linux kernel under the hood, so I'd think it's pretty well swap and go

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[–] Sam_Bass@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago

Just another way to force you to buy a new one

[–] chemicalwonka@discuss.tchncs.de 0 points 3 months ago

Late stage capitalism

[–] dumbass@leminal.space 0 points 3 months ago

They no roll?

[–] Gsus4@programming.dev 0 points 3 months ago (7 children)

.......linux cars? Pretty please?

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