I think I'm missing something with "41" is it some kind of dog whistle?
this post was submitted on 19 Jul 2024
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41%, or the statistic of how many transgender people have attempted to commit suicide.
Sometimes used as a synonym for suicide.
Of course it's something horrific like that. Fuck those people. 41 goes on my dog whistle list.
I feel my life is happier not knowing or caring about their dog whistles. Is that harmful to others?
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Would you share that list?
I don't want to live on the same planet with anyone who would quote that statistic for any reason other than an emphatic demand for action to lower it
I don't understand how anyone can think hate is ever the right thing to do.
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41?
Cherry picked statistic of transgender suicide rate. They only look at that number, but never why that number is so high.
It's almost like constant bullying has a major effect on people's mental health
Man that number is high
It's also not the suicide rate. It's either the has attempted suicide at least once in their life rate or the thought about it rate. Can't quite remember which, but definitely not the suicide rate.
And if it is the suicide rate there's no way it isn't massively skewed by doing some fuckery about who is counted.
Even including attempts that's high as shit. Thought about it, then it might not be that high, depending on how serious the thought have to be.
I'm fairly certain it's attempts now that I've looked at it again. It's been a long time since I've read breakdowns of the studies and what the numbers all mean. It wasn't as simple as 41% of trans people attempt suicide. The numbers went down post transition and I don't think suicide attempts had to be serious attempts to be counted (I think it's worth nitpicking this).
Edit: Tried finding the survey the number comes from and got a bunch of different responses that are just confusing me more at this point. I'm probably done here, since researching suicide statistics isn't a ton of fun.
That's understandable
Who hasn't thought about suicide even once in their life? I mean really.
A bit of the call of the void every now and then keeps you on the edge
Thought? Sure. But this was "attempted", which is way past thinking of it
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Like me in high school.
Is that referring to 41%, 41 per 1000, or some other metric entirely? Either way it's too damn high, but I'm curious and I don't know how to go about researching it without potentially making the almighty algorithm think I'm anti-trans.
Bullying would not explain that high of a number unless direct persecution is shown to have very high suicide rates.
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Pardon my ignorance, but what does cis mean?
“cis” and “trans” are prefixes denoting on what “side” something is. “cis” means “on this/our side”, while “trans” refers to “the other side”, for example:
- “Cisalpina” is how the Romans referred to their side of the Alps (modern day Italy), while “Transalpina” referred to land on the other side of the alps.
- There exist certain pairs of molecules with either a “cis” or “trans” prefix, depending on whether certain identical groups are on the same side or on opposite sides, respectively.
The modern use of “cis” and “trans” is generally about gender. A cisgender person is someone whose gender identity aligns with their sex assigned at birth, while a transgender person is someone for whom that doesn’t hold true.
In this meme, the person on the right is wearing a transgender flag for a shirt, and presumably offending the cisgender person on the left by calling them cis. The meme is making fun of the fact that some cisgender people consider “cis” an insult, when it really only is a neutral and non-offensive description.
I try to make this as exeggerated and stupid of an example as possible if I got it right:
So… let’s say if a 37 year old man, born male, with a wife, born female, who is married with kids with a house in suburbia and stable income, calls some regular thai ladyboy a “fag”, while said ladyboy counters “pretty harsh tone for a cis” and then that 37 year old man gets angry over the fact that he’s being called “cis”… That man is being angry about the fact that he is being called non-trans?
The outrage is more that a label is being applied to them. They want it to be 'women' and 'trans women', where only 'non-normal' identities get a label.
The application of 'cis' bothers conservatives because it changes the narrative, from people who identify as their assigned sex being 'the default', into cis people just another state of identity with no more significance than the others.
Huh…. Weird. And here I am, having grown up with an aunt who always wanted to be a man, and to be honest, I never questioned it. I got told as a kid that he felt he was born in the wrong body, so I just went with it. I never had the urge to call him a trans-woman or anything, not even as a teen. Might be good to get rid of that trans thing.
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Can i just thank you so very much for that amazing etymology summary you just made? I can't even grammar right now, love it!
Thanks for the clear explenation! Further comments say it's a pretty neutral identification, but to me it sounds like there's two sides of it and one is bad. I presume this feeling is incorrect?
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It’s short for cisgender, which is basically the opposite of transgender. Cis and trans are both Latin prefixes, meaning ‘same side of’ and ‘opposite side of.’
Like Inside as the outside. Do you feel like a man and were born male, do you feel like a woman and were born female? Then you are cis. It's the opposite of trans: inside not like the outside.
Ooh, thanks for the insight!
So does that mean one could be Cis and Gay for example? As in feeling like a man and born male, and also attracted to men?
Yeah, pretty much. IIUC being trans does not have anything to do with terms for sexual attraction.
Question for the crowd who understands this better, a transwoman attracted to women is still termed a lesbian, right?
Yep. Gay transmen, Bi transpeople, Lesbian transwomen and every other sexual attraction paired with the queer spectrum.
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As in feeling like a man and born male, and also attracted to men?
Yes. Those are the manliest of men.
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The use of the word cis has its roots in an obscure Usenet group; it's genesis (apparently) rooted in a desire for more inclusive language for trans folks (the notion that "gender" Vs "transgender" was too othering).
It hit Tumblr like a train in the 2010s, and became a symbolic phrase in trans counterculture. "Cisgender" was less than popular with non-trans people, as it robbed them of the illusion of normality and turned the word "gender" into a social trap.
It later found derogatory use in the phrase "cissy" (a counter for the popular derogatory term "tranny").
It's a fun word with an interesting history, and it has helped contribute to the wider acceptance of trans folks.
Born as the gender you identify with.
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Cissy boy
What?
I'm cis. I'm a cis man with a exclusive sexual interest in cis women. I find the term very helpful to express very clearly who I am and what I want. I can't imagine being so delicate as to lose my shit over being called cis.
Wow guys, get a load of this cissy over here!
(Jk me too lol)
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Imagine we joked about cisgender men suicide rates the same way we joke about transgender suicide rates.
Plus this statistic is flawed. It comes from an older study that does not even compare pre- to post- transition.
People who joke like that are disgusting.
I don't care who you are, if your best option is suicide, we failed you and we should be sorry.
In fact, the American Psychological Association warns that manhood and masculinity are so construed by society's expectations, that being a man poses mental health risks itself.
There is a whole subdiscipline that focuses on 'counseling men".
Not to mention no one of this lot wants to have this discussion, either online or IRL.
https://www.apa.org/about/policy/boys-men-practice-guidelines.pdf
That is literally exactly what is happening. MtF transwomen are considered men by haters and hence get the male treatment of crass jokes and lack of support.
Transphobia is the intersection of misandry and toxic masculinity and all of it is gross.
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