this post was submitted on 05 Oct 2024
270 points (93.0% liked)
Asklemmy
43984 readers
738 users here now
A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions
Search asklemmy ๐
If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!
- Open-ended question
- Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
- Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
- Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
- An actual topic of discussion
Looking for support?
Looking for a community?
- Lemmyverse: community search
- sub.rehab: maps old subreddits to fediverse options, marks official as such
- !lemmy411@lemmy.ca: a community for finding communities
~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de~
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
It's more because it's a bunch of random assertions, falsehoods, misunderstandings, half-truths, and more with no substance to tackle and respond to without starting a lengthy struggle session.
The USSR absolutely was guided by Communist ideology, and was Socialist, that's true. It's also true that it wasn't perfect. A good article to read is Why do Marxists Fail to Bring the "Worker's Paradise?" because many people don't understand Marxism and interpret it through an idealist, anti-Marxist lens. The article is pro-Marxist-Leninist, and anti-ultraleftist, and attempts to highlight the impossibilities of establishing an idealized form of Socialism through fiat, without strong development of the productive forces and centralization.
Centralization = corruption
Explain. You cannot achieve democratic control without centralization, because you can't have inputs with no output.
Issue of centralization is regime and politics agnostic. More centralization just results in more corruption.
I am not sure how to run the society any other way but we know that current systems are corrupted by the ruling elites at our expense.
Legal system is unwilling to deal with it because the judiciary are just regime lapdogs used against working people when they get out of line.
Again, please explain. This doesn't logically follow.
Capitalism is, Socialism isn't.
In Capitalism, yes.
Have you read Marx?
If you are big daddy owner, centralized state permits you to have access to the top guy who can do anything.
It is a lot easier to corrupt one guy, then it is to do one guy in every state for example is the logic here.
This is inherent defect of centralization. Sure we can get a lot of shit done effectively if everybody is good faith actor. And progress has been made but it was done with a ton of grift that we just accept
Capitalism and socialism are economic system for property. We are talking about the state in of itself here.
I would posit the issue not economic system choice but rather corruptions of the ruling class.
I bet any properly set up system would work as long as it was designed to work properly.
If you notice the best systems we currently have are actually a mix of both.
There is a strong correlation between quality of life of the working class and corruption.
Countries with low corruption are able to deliver high quality of life because they don't a lot of blatant looting.
I bet this will be the down fall of the US empire, the parasite class taking too much and it is causing serious social issues for Americans. They know something is wrong bit they jerk politics without realizing it is a futile exercise.
This isn't really accurate, though, this is just an argument against democracy. Recall elections are standard Marxist practice, which pretty much eliminates this problem outright. It seems like you haven't engaged with Marxist organizational theory.
They are always present linked. You can't divorce them, the Base creates and supports the Superstructure.
This is generally unfounded.
You can't "design" a system, that's utopianism.
No, the best systems currently are Socialist. There are no "mixes." Or, at least, everything is a mix, no system has made it to Communism yet, but the best systems are run along Marxist lines.
This is more correlation and not causation.